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Author Topic: Project CB350F cafe brat  (Read 7240 times)

Offline stubsryan

  • Posts: 72
Re: Project CB350F cafe brat
« Reply #40 on: Mar 09, 2018, 05:05:43 »
Order is on hold pending more info. Thanks a bunch everyone


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Offline jpmobius

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Re: Project CB350F cafe brat
« Reply #41 on: Mar 09, 2018, 11:33:42 »
In general, I don't think a wider than desired rim is better than a narrower than desired rim, but it seems in my experience that tires of any particular size vary a fair bit depending on the manufacturer especially in cross section.  In other words, a 90/90 x 18 tire from brand x can be distorted much differently than the same tire from brand y on the same wider (or narrower) than optimal rim.  That's just an opinion based on my own experience and is totally non-scientific.  Certainly a tire with a higher aspect ratio (the lower the second number is the higher the aspect ratio) will be more affected since the sidewall will be shorter.  You can imagine how much different the installed cross section of a 110/80 tire will look on a 2.5 or 3.0 rim - how adversely this will impact the performance of the tire is hard to say and no doubt would depend on the manufacturer, but it is not something I would want to do.  That said, I fit a tire that is appropriate to the rim, and if I am determined to fit a wider or narrower tire I change the rim width.  I wouldn't worry at all about miss-matching rims aside from wanting them to look the same. 

Keep in mind that your bike originally came with a 1.6 front and a 1.85 rear (from memory - which never was that great) and drove very nicely.  Going up one size front and back, and fitting appropriate tires is a much more substantial change than may seem to be intuitively obvious as bikes as a rule are fairly sensitive to tire and wheel sizes.  And remember, the wheel weight - which is all unsprung weight is at least as, if not more so, important as tire size and might even be a lot of the impact of fitting larger tires as bigger tires are substantially heavier.  So when you go up just one size in rim width and fit appropriate tires, you are adding both wheel and tire weight both front and back and you can imagine that not being inconsequential.  Plus, adding insult to injury, you will have to run inner tubes on the spoke wheels.  All that extra weight is weight that your suspension has to deal with, and as likely you will be reducing the overall weight of the bike - none of it from the wheels, the unsprung weight ratio will become smaller which works against you even further.  So you have a very strong incentive for making and keeping the wheel/tire package as light as possible. The smaller and lighter the bike, the more important the wheel weight is.  In general, I go up one size in rim width if I am building new wheels, and fit the matching tires.  Part of that is due to the tire size availability.  A 90/90 x 18 tire is a mighty small tire these days!
« Last Edit: Mar 09, 2018, 11:36:24 by jpmobius »
Mobius


On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero.

1973 RD350 Yamaha build  http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=66498.0

Offline stubsryan

  • Posts: 72
Re: Project CB350F cafe brat
« Reply #42 on: Mar 09, 2018, 18:56:16 »
In general, I don't think a wider than desired rim is better than a narrower than desired rim, but it seems in my experience that tires of any particular size vary a fair bit depending on the manufacturer especially in cross section.  In other words, a 90/90 x 18 tire from brand x can be distorted much differently than the same tire from brand y on the same wider (or narrower) than optimal rim.  That's just an opinion based on my own experience and is totally non-scientific.  Certainly a tire with a higher aspect ratio (the lower the second number is the higher the aspect ratio) will be more affected since the sidewall will be shorter.  You can imagine how much different the installed cross section of a 110/80 tire will look on a 2.5 or 3.0 rim - how adversely this will impact the performance of the tire is hard to say and no doubt would depend on the manufacturer, but it is not something I would want to do.  That said, I fit a tire that is appropriate to the rim, and if I am determined to fit a wider or narrower tire I change the rim width.  I wouldn't worry at all about miss-matching rims aside from wanting them to look the same. 

Keep in mind that your bike originally came with a 1.6 front and a 1.85 rear (from memory - which never was that great) and drove very nicely.  Going up one size front and back, and fitting appropriate tires is a much more substantial change than may seem to be intuitively obvious as bikes as a rule are fairly sensitive to tire and wheel sizes.  And remember, the wheel weight - which is all unsprung weight is at least as, if not more so, important as tire size and might even be a lot of the impact of fitting larger tires as bigger tires are substantially heavier.  So when you go up just one size in rim width and fit appropriate tires, you are adding both wheel and tire weight both front and back and you can imagine that not being inconsequential.  Plus, adding insult to injury, you will have to run inner tubes on the spoke wheels.  All that extra weight is weight that your suspension has to deal with, and as likely you will be reducing the overall weight of the bike - none of it from the wheels, the unsprung weight ratio will become smaller which works against you even further.  So you have a very strong incentive for making and keeping the wheel/tire package as light as possible. The smaller and lighter the bike, the more important the wheel weight is.  In general, I go up one size in rim width if I am building new wheels, and fit the matching tires.  Part of that is due to the tire size availability.  A 90/90 x 18 tire is a mighty small tire these days!
Excellent advice! I will change my order. Hopefully I can find 1.85 for the front and 2.15 for the rear. This bike is a combination of form and functionality with each being as important as the other. Short of that I will get 2.15 front and rear. It just seems really hard to get smaller than 2.15x18 rims on Alibaba. Itís all my budget will allow as Iím running a business with other commitments. Thanks mate


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Offline farmer92

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Re: Project CB350F cafe brat
« Reply #43 on: Mar 10, 2018, 05:35:55 »
Was going through Tony Foaleís book ďMotorcycle handling and chassis designĒ
Thereís a whole chapter on tires that makes for an interesting read.
There may be a PDF link floating around somewhere on the web, i recommend reading it.


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Offline stubsryan

  • Posts: 72
Re: Project CB350F cafe brat
« Reply #44 on: Mar 20, 2018, 04:28:10 »
Thanks for the advice I have rims on the way. Also ordered a pamco electronic ignition with coils, leads and spark plug caps. Couldnít help myself and ordered some rear shocks as well. I got some new carby rubbers which are way over priced. $80! Finally, I have a carb rebuild kit in the way and thatís what Iím working on at the moment. Just split it all down and have it soaking in mineral turpentine at the moment. Itís all filthy! probably going to buy an ultra sonic bath cleaner tomorrow to get them looking clean


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Offline stubsryan

  • Posts: 72
Re: Project CB350F cafe brat
« Reply #45 on: Mar 20, 2018, 04:30:10 »
The ultra sonic cleaner will help the rust as well I hope 🤞


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Offline WhyNot

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Re: Project CB350F cafe brat
« Reply #46 on: Mar 20, 2018, 06:19:52 »
Can't hurt it, I would guess....!!!
2006 Harley Davidson Heritage Softail
1975 Honda CB750K5 needs carb work
1974 Honda CB350F2 needs tins painted (being lazy)
1972 Honda CB175K2 roller no engine
1972 Honda CB/CL350 Engines need roller
1972 Honda SL350K2 Frame for above engine
1972 Honda CB100K2 needs kicker shaft
1990 Mitsubishi MM needs engine rebuild
1984 Dodge D50 Beater DD since 1997

Offline Sav0r

  • Posts: 619
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Re: Project CB350F cafe brat
« Reply #47 on: Mar 20, 2018, 10:02:08 »
Hopefully that carburetor is less googly eyed when it comes out of the tank.
Sav0r the adventure.

Visit www.chrislivengood.net to get more information on my RD350 dubbed Mia Wallace as well as my other projects and snafus.

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Offline stubsryan

  • Posts: 72
Re: Project CB350F cafe brat
« Reply #48 on: Mar 25, 2018, 02:26:54 »
Carbs are getting there. Will post photos when they look cleaned up.


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Offline stubsryan

  • Posts: 72
Re: Project CB350F cafe brat
« Reply #49 on: Mar 25, 2018, 02:32:38 »
So Iím working on the tank at the moment while I can do some grinding during the day. Two areas that I have been putting off are the tank and rear hoop. So this tank isnít original to the 350 so itís being a bit difficult to make look right. I like the shape so Iím determined to make it work. Hereís the issue, I want the bottom line of the tank to run parallel with the seat section. Also it canít foul the side covers. The straight up option is to lift the tank at the front and rear until it all clears the side covers and is level. Thing is, it sits super high up at the steering colum/triple clamp.


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