Biting the hand that feeds all of us... or however that saying goes.

irk miller

irk miller

You've been mostly-dead all day.
DTT BOTM WINNER
Not sure if this guy's karma is suffering, but maybe it needs to. As if the industry needs it's own actively trying to kill it.

https://www.revzilla.com/common-tread/could-this-lawsuit-affect-track-days-and-club-racing
 
I posted a lot of replies in there, pissed me off no end :mad:
There are a lot of greedy assholes who don't give a shit about anyone when they can make a quick buck,
Yep, sorry he got hurt but he meissed rider meeting plus did a bunch of laps before he 'squidded out'
Target fixation on the sandbags meant the inevitable happened. If her had just kept it leaned over he would have been fine but shutting off lifted bike then it just goes where your looking. Someone pointed out it would be interesting to know if he rode 'morning session' and if so, how many laps had he really done.I would be interested to know if he had done track days there previously, if he did morning session and if he was worried, did he complain
 
Seca is one of the few road courses in North America I've not had the opportunity to visit. So I don't have much opinion on the run off or management. That said, the track has been under siege for many years, and as a staple it will be sad if this is the final nail in the coffin. Don't step on a track if you aren't ready for the consequences.
 
There is no Personal Responsibility with a very large majority of people.
"It's not my fault I fucked up, someone should have stopped me from fucking up. Now Pay Me!".
And sadly, there are Judges and Lawyers who want to make a name for themselves rather than enforce the law, will sit back and say..."By God you're right! There should've been a warning label stating You should never juggle electric chainsaws in the shower while simultaneously masturbating with a slapchop and eating a snickers bar... when you have a peanut allergy! Mr Peanut, Black and Decker, Vince, and Mother Nature need to be held accountable!!

::) ::) ::)
 
Sav0r said:
Don't step on a track if you aren't ready for the consequences.
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This.
What a joke.
I think even his lawyer thinks it’s a joke as they even named Mazda as a defendant even though all they do is pay to have their name put up there.
Also who cuts their demands by 2/3 after the first rejection?

What a dink.
 
Been following this for a bit.

Going to be interesting.

Whoever thought sandbags in the immediate area of the track was a good idea, is a moron. That turns what could be a simple run off, and rejoin, into a serious injury.

I'm not entirely sure how I feel about it. I certainly don't want track days, or groups like AHRMA and Wera to suffer, but damn, who's stupid enough to put sand bags around like that? I guess, what it boils down to; Was it simply a racing accident, or negligence on the organizers behalf. You could argue it either way, if you're being objective.
 
I just hope karma comes back to bite his company in the butt That contraption looks like a lawsuit on wheels, anyway!
 
Redbird said:
You should never juggle electric chainsaws in the shower while simultaneously masturbating with a slapchop and eating a snickers bar... when you have a peanut allergy!
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wait... you're not supposed to..

daily routine is scrapped I guess
 
There's 2 sides to every coin.

The guy is a total douche for suing for the crazy amount of money that he is suing for.

On the other hand though I believe he has a right to do so. The company putting on the event has a responsibility for the safety of the riders, putting a damn sandbag anywhere near the track IS in my book gross negligence. In a car event it would be fine, but for a motorcycle day no way. That's a way to get someone killed who should have just slid out.

You guys cant tell me that if they randomly placed concrete barriers in the run-off areas that it would still be the riders fault? Same thing, it's a danger to the rider and should not be there. There is a reason turns on a track are free of obstructions, so that WHEN not IF you run off you don't die. Putting things there be it a sand bag, a concrete barrier or a 9 foot rubber dildo is unacceptable if you ask me.

I think he has every right to sue for medical expenses, but is a total asshole for trying to get 15 million out of it.
 
SONIC. said:
There's 2 sides to every coin.

The guy is a total douche for suing for the crazy amount of money that he is suing for.

On the other hand though I believe he has a right to do so. The company putting on the event has a responsibility for the safety of the riders, putting a damn sandbag anywhere near the track IS in my book gross negligence. In a car event it would be fine, but for a motorcycle day no way. That's a way to get someone killed who should have just slid out.

You guys cant tell me that if they randomly placed concrete barriers in the run-off areas that it would still be the riders fault? Same thing, it's a danger to the rider and should not be there. There is a reason turns on a track are free of obstructions, so that WHEN not IF you run off you don't die. Putting things there be it a sand bag, a concrete barrier or a 9 foot rubber dildo is unacceptable if you ask me.

I think he has every right to sue for medical expenses, but is a total asshole for trying to get 15 million out of it.
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Pretty much my thoughts on it.

Dick for trying to get rich off it. The track people are idiots.
 
MiniatureNinja said:
wait... you're not supposed to..

daily routine is scrapped I guess
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I just switched to gas powered chainsaws and Almond Joy bars. I refused to eliminate the Slapchop, because by God, that's just too much fun ;)

After seeing the vid, I agree, it was poorly placed sandbags.
But my thought is, If it was discussed in the riders meeting... that he missed... it's on him. But even if it wasn't specifically discussed, he made several laps with bags in place and never felt the need to alert anyone of his concerns. Not until HE fucked up and subsequently hit one, that it became an issue.
He made a choice to ride in what he considers/considered an unsafe environment. Both by missing the drivers meeting, and not following a "see something, say something" train of thought after completing more than a few laps.

And just to briefly revisit the poor judgment of the track officials... What respectable track organization allows a rider to participate after missing the riders meeting?
Every trackday I ever attended had the rule "You miss the riders meeting, you don't ride".
 
SONIC. said:
There's 2 sides to every coin.
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life isn't a coin. We are in a Linear universe - only ONE set of events happened.

The guy is a total douche for suing for the crazy amount of money that he is suing for.

On the other hand though I believe he has a right to do so. The company putting on the event has a responsibility for the safety of the riders, putting a damn sandbag anywhere near the track IS in my book gross negligence. In a car event it would be fine, but for a motorcycle day no way. That's a way to get someone killed who should have just slid out.
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you can't have it both ways. These lawsuits are his way for him to get someone else on the hook for his multiple mistakes. he assumes liability. A sandbag is not "GROSS" Negligance - at least any more than a tack with 8" ruts from erosion would be considered.

You guys cant tell me that if they randomly placed concrete barriers in the run-off areas that it would still be the riders fault? Same thing, it's a danger to the rider and should not be there. There is a reason turns on a track are free of obstructions, so that WHEN not IF you run off you don't die. Putting things there be it a sand bag, a concrete barrier or a 9 foot rubber dildo is unacceptable if you ask me.
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who told you to put concrete barriers there? who did put them there? no one? oh.
BTW, the track and riding surface WAS free of obstruction. he came off the track in an area several experts have already stated he should not have - you cannot plan for every possible contingency and it's not the track or even organizer's responsibility to do so. If there were sand traps there and the rider broke his wrist... we'd be here still.


I think he has every right to sue for medical expenses, but is a total asshole for trying to get 15 million out of it.
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of course he has a right to sue... he doesn't have a right to win that suit... and I hope to god he doesn't, and I also hope he never gets on a motorcycle again, or sells a motorcycle, or goes anywhere near a motorcycle. I hope every painful step he takes is a reminder to own up to his mistakes. I have a right to feel that way.
 
IMO if the bags hadn't been there he would have had the same result. You can see the erosion the sand bags are helping control. He would have gone into those and probably ended up tumbling.
 
MiniatureNinja said:
life isn't a coin. We are in a Linear universe - only ONE set of events happened.

you can't have it both ways. These lawsuits are his way for him to get someone else on the hook for his multiple mistakes. he assumes liability. A sandbag is not "GROSS" Negligance - at least any more than a tack with 8" ruts from erosion would be considered.

who told you to put concrete barriers there? who did put them there? no one? oh.
BTW, the track and riding surface WAS free of obstruction. he came off the track in an area several experts have already stated he should not have - you cannot plan for every possible contingency and it's not the track or even organizer's responsibility to do so. If there were sand traps there and the rider broke his wrist... we'd be here still.


of course he has a right to sue... he doesn't have a right to win that suit... and I hope to god he doesn't, and I also hope he never gets on a motorcycle again, or sells a motorcycle, or goes anywhere near a motorcycle. I hope every painful step he takes is a reminder to own up to his mistakes. I have a right to feel that way.
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You can be as angry as you want but it doesn't make you right ;D

The issue was not his mistake, being a less than optimal rider wasn't the problem, the problem was that he had a ridiculous hazard literally 3 feet off the track in an area that is designed and designated a runoff area that's supposed to be relatively safe to wreck in. That's the whole point of going to a track to ride like that as opposed to doing so on the street, you can over do it and not hit a god damn sand bag. You're supposed to be able to run off the track and lay it over and walk away, not hit a damn sand bag (or an 8" deep rut) and break your femur.

While we're on that point I don't think the huge ruts are okay either, that's poor track maintenance. Why bother going to a track if the consequences for spirited riding are the same as on the street?

Again you're entitled to your opinion, even if it's wrong ;D
 
Rat_ranger said:
IMO if the bags hadn't been there he would have had the same result. You can see the erosion the sand bags are helping control. He would have gone into those and probably ended up tumbling.
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Probably true. But those shouldn't have been there either, it's a danger to the rider and the responsibility of the track to take care of in my opinion.
 
SONIC. said:
the problem was that he had a ridiculous hazard literally 3 feet off the track in an area that is designed and designated a runoff area that's supposed to be relatively safe to wreck in.
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That is not a designated runoff area. It's sand because it's a desert and the runoff the sandbags are placed to prevent inhibits vegetation growth. The run off areas are dark grey. He was through the turn.

My biggest contention is that he attempted to sue for $15mill, then he lied about what actually happened to manipulate impression of fault on his part, ie. "he took evasive action to avoid a slower rider."
 

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Lots of good points. Nice discussion.

There seems to be enough blame to go around. He should not have been on the track after missing the riders meeting. Running off was entirely his own fault - so that's two areas of contributory negligence.

That sandbag probably should not have been there. It's supposed to be a run off area FFS. And should not flip bikes when they use it. That said, it was not a world class race event with a cast of thousands grooming the surfaces, so it is important that people running events point out the dangers to riders.

And on top of that he's a total dick for suing for anything much over the medical expenses not covered by his own insurance. IMHO.
 
SONIC. said:
kujqfoA.gif
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Sorry, your reply reminded me of this ;D


*this was solely my observation and in no way a representation/interpretation of Sonics actual reply
 
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