1970 Triumph Tiger 650

deviant said:
He's setting this up almost identical to the GPZ750 lashup I have on my CB, aside from the very vertical placement of the caliper. Not sure how this won't work fine just like it is. All the bar is doing is keeping it from rotating.
Ideally I would liked to have had the caliper in the 2:00 position in front of the shock. But due to the caliper mounting plate being right against the axle slot plate and the swing arm tubing being wider it just couldn't work there, bummer.
 
i wasn't trying to say having it lashed pushing the caliper would not work, it just isn't nearly as good as having the stay rod in pull
there are all kinds of reasons why its beter inj pull vs push
with a caliper mounted following/pull instead of leading/pushed ,it takes away all kinds of forces that are present in push and just removes them from the picture
one big advantage is weight of the parts can be reduced because they handle less stacked-up multi-axis loading
the trailing caliper always has an easy job to stay aligned with the rotor becsause it is being dragged not pushed for example take a flexible long rod and try ti skid a heavy object acro\ss the gravel in your living room floor
well it wants to kick sideways and bend the rod the sdprings and bucks,on a brake desiogn this is inviting brake chatter
but if you put a hook on the rod and pull the goddam thing it is way different
thats the gist of it
marks setup
mark it really should not have a heim at both ends or at least not just the single one at the caliper
the oems that push the calliper like you are use a very stout caliper carier that is clamped in mate with axle
it,they also use a stay arm mount at the caliper that does not allow twisting to any degree and its a huge heavy arm with another non spherical lash at the front
it is all overkill for sure but the reasins are still present
mark ,to work smoothly and preclude brake chatter you should have a wide clevis type bracket at the calliper ,the stay arm ideally something large like 1" thinwall steel tube and another oiutrer tab bracket up at the front stay arm lash point on the swinger
it could be 2 heims on a y splitter up at the caliper
but in actuality using heims is not needed at all in your application and it works against you
your caliper bracket is fixed to the axle to be correct it should also be fixed tight at both ends of the stay bar/rod
all the heims will do is wear and create slack that opens the door to allow brake chatter to step in quite easilly if it feels like it
the setup you are building would be adequate in pull except for the front single tab,any rod end mounts should always whenever possible be a double sided affair its just so much more mechanically sound
mark in my opinion your lashup it is inadequate pushing the caliper and it is a great safety concern as well
and the main reason is the single tab at the front mount, i would be more comforttable if it was done like it can and should be
the other is the heims are definately out of place and can do more harm than good
a bearing on the rod ends is only needed when a rod is in motion in use in theory you do not have any motion.. excpet to adjust the chain it doesn't reqouire spherical rods ends for occasional non loaded movement


t
 
htown16;8196849 said:
Next time try this. Put the rings on the pistons. Also, put in the 2 inner piston pin clips. With the barrel upside down on the bench, use ring compressors or your fingers and insert each piston. With the rods at tdc, set the barrel and pistons on some blocks on the crankcase. Line up the rods with the piston pin holes, insert the pins, add the outer clips and drop the barrel over the studs. Job done.

I decided to give your way a try as the other was being a PITA. It was way easier this way. Even without wood blocks or anything I was able to get the rings compressed with just my fingers and then lower the cylinder over the pistons, holding it in such a way that I could lower it and hold pressure on one pin until it slid in, then slid in the other pin. Made sure to remember the circlips and the base gasket and cinch the nuts down. Time to move on back to the clutch issues.



That liquid on the timing cover is sweat equity.

 
ha... was planning to get to where we could install the cylinder on my T120R last night but my gasket set did not have the Tappet block O-Rings... so I gotta source some O-Rings and get those blocks installed.

Keep going mate.
 
Got the cylinders installed and cinched down before realizing I had forgotten to install the tappets in the blocks.


So I had to pull it all back down and install them. I've heard how important it was to make sure each tappet goes back in the same place it came out, but in my case the cylinder was in a box and the tappets where in a different box so I had no idea where they came from. Fortunately the exhaust tappets have oiling holes in the bottoms and one side so locating them was easy as they could only go one way. the intakes were symmetrical so I don't know if they are correct for left and right or front and rear. they showed no wear so I'm not concerned.


Back together now after replacing the base gasket that destroyed itself on removal. Fortunately I had a spare from the top end kit I had purchased before I knew i would be doing a complete overhaul and ordering a full engine kit.



 
Looking good, never saw a blacked out meriden engine that actually looked nice before!
Now make sure you get pushrod tube seal crush right, on my 500 i had to use a little extra crush since the tubes are not perpendicular to either head or block! :D
 
I'll post a pic tomorrow but I'm trying to decide if I should leave the PRT's chrome or black them out also. There is virtually no chrome left on the bike elsewhere.
 
Ended up having a hell of a time getting the crush height on the push rod tubes just right. It calls for a gap of .040" before torqueing the head down. As it turns out my brother must have done some research when he wanted the Bonneville head and apparantly traded the whole top end of the 70 Tiger for the whole top end from a 66 Bonneville. This explains why the bike had no top end on it and all the top end parts were in a separate box. The top end works as a package so you must use the same year cylinders, tappet blocks, and push rod tubes. There are slight mods between the different years in the cylinder heads and the push rod tubes so getting the gap correct with the available seals can be tricky. There are basically 3 different thicknesses of seals usually using a thin on on the bottom and a thicker one on top. As it turns out even with 2 of the thinnest ones on top and bottom my gap was excessive and a solution was needed. Someone mentioned that cutting seal in half on the lathe was an option. So I went to work in my mind on how to accomplish this. I decided that slipping the seal over a piece of PVC tubing that was slightly larger would work. I pushed a socket snuggly over the end of the PVC tube and pushed the seal against it to try and keep it square to the tool. I put a new blade in my knife and turn it on and tried to carefully cut the seal in half. Well the blade wouldn't start the cut at all when it was turning under power. So I shut it off and started the cut by hand and once I was through the seal completely I turn the lathe chuck by hand carefully eyeballing the thickness and after a few attempts was able to get a number of different thickness seals made. 2 of them came out to be enough to exactly get the .040" crush I would need. The head can now be torqued down for the final time and I can move on to the next task at hand which is fixing a crossed thread on one of the clutch bolts to finish the motor build and get it back in the frame.












Here it is with a gap of .080-.090", too much gap.







Here is the head sitting on the head gasket with no seals, you want a .040" gap there before torqueing the head down. In the previous pic you can see the gap at about .080-.090".


 
you are on the right track cutting the bushings,but it near impossible to get a non wobbly cut groove holding the blade i tried it on the polurethane shock eye bushings hand held ...i ended up using a small block plane blade having a slot in the blade made it easy to mount to a tool post.cutting edge just vertical and plunge in as long as the edge is nicely honed very sharp it works perfect
for your washers set the compound paralell to the bed get position lock the carrige then cutting the second one and any more can be quite precise by using the compound to move over the thickness of washer you need
sometinmes a lil wd40 really helps knife parting ruibber or poly stock
 
Nice work! I exaggerated the crush on my 500 since it refused to stop leaking and the pushrod tubes were not perpendicular, so i had to use a .060 crush to get a good seal.
 
They tell me .060 is too much and there is concern for warping the head if the gap is too much.
Now I have to strip the rocker boxes and coat them.
 
I took the gamble and it worked, hard to see how a few thou's of rubber can warp even my marginal 8 stud head. Then again there is so much i will never understand
Like why pushrod tubes are angled 1-2 degrees on the 500's and straight on the 650's!
 
datadavid said:
I took the gamble and it worked, hard to see how a few thou's of rubber can warp even my marginal 8 stud head. Then again there is so much i will never understand
Like why pushrod tubes are angled 1-2 degrees on the 500's and straight on the 650's!
I don't believe they are straight on a 650, at least mine aren't, they narrow at the top.

I find it hard to believe also that a few thou (.010-.020") of silicone will make the head warp with only 18ft lbs on 9 bolts holding it down. But the experienced experts tell me differently.
 
o1marc said:
I don't believe they are straight on a 650, at least mine aren't, they narrow at the top.

I find it hard to believe also that a few thou (.010-.020") of silicone will make the head warp with only 18ft lbs on 9 bolts holding it down. But the experienced experts tell me differently.

I noticed theres a lot of voodoo in the britbike game.. whatever works i guess.. my torque spec is 25ft lbs. Must be cause of that missing center bolt.
Is viton a silicone mix? The voodoo guys always tell me tube seals must be viton to last any length of time..
 
datadavid said:
I noticed theres a lot of voodoo in the britbike game.. whatever works i guess.. my torque spec is 25ft lbs. Must be cause of that missing center bolt.
Is viton a silicone mix? The voodoo guys always tell me tube seals must be viton to last any length of time..
"Viton is a brand of synthetic rubber and fluoropolymer elastomer commonly used in O-rings, chemical-resistant gloves, and other molded or extruded goods. The name is a registered trademark of DuPont Performance Elastomers L.L.C.."
 
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