78 CB550 Carb Cleaning Question

J

jryftc

Guest
Hey,

Going through a set of CB550 carburetors cleaning them (1978). Planning on just boiling them in lemon juice (Don't have access to a sonic cleaner). I noticed it almost seems rubbery where the needle/piston assembly goes up and down. Is it okay to throw that in the boiling water or am I gonna fuck myself?
 
Regardless of the cleaning method you use, you must 100% disassemble the carbs. Yes, 100% means 100%. Otherwise you are totally wasting your time. There are no shortcuts or exceptions. Once disassembled, most of the time all you will need is spray carb cleaner - though if they have not been in use for a while more comprehensive measures may be needed. Resist the temptation to replace any hard parts in your carbs with those from a "rebuild" kit. Gaskets and o-rings only, and sometimes the needle and seat. All those brass jets and needles in most kits are of inferior quality to what you have already so use the originals. If the needles are worn, get OEM replacements and toss the carb kit parts.
 
Yea, I was going to take them all apart, it just looks like one part in there is a softer rubber like material and I didn't want to ruin it boiling it or something. I've always found original parts work the best too, and I wasn't really planning on replacing main jets. I've taken them out and they look good. I'm really only having a problem with one of the carbs so I wanted to completely disassemble them and start from scratch. They are clean.

However, I think that one carb I'm having trouble with is running lean (popping out the back of it, pipe not getting hot as fast as others). I was gonna check and replace that needle, and already ordered a carb kit I might just use if the needle is damaged.
 
Check the valve lash and do a compression check before you condemn the carb.
 
Compression Reads 120 across the board. All carbs running fine (4 is a little rich), but 3 seems like it's starving. Can you check a valve lash without pulling the engine on a 550? As an aside I've done like 70 on this bike it just putts out the back the rest of the carbs were running decent when i looked at the plugs. The air box adaptors a few are cracked, manifolds are fine. Would the bike be running that well if was a latch?
 
So I have these things pretty damn disassembled. As far as gaskets, weird little o-rings and screws go, but they're still attached as four. Not really trying to take them apart body by body, curious if as is 80% taken apart soaking them in a hot solution with lemon juice or whatever would be deemed "safe"
 

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You can just spray carb cleaner thru each port with the long nozzle . . if it comes out freely in another area, it is likely good enough . . you can also pull a wire off a wire wheel and poke it in the jets and carb ports.
 
Unless it's a brass wire wheel, I would not use steel wires to clean jets and ports. Use copper wire. Steel can scratch and gouge the soft aluminum and brass jets.....too likely a possibility of scratching or gouging and causing damage.
 
You won't hurt anything with a steel wire and unless the brass wire is pretty stiff it will do little to nothing.
 
Okay, just to be redundant, DO NOT USE A STEEL IMPLIMENT OF ANY KIND WHEN CLEANING CARBURETOR JETS. I use the fine wire from a household apleince cord. it's small enough and soft enough to not cause damage to a pilot jet. Once you can get the wire though chemical cleaners can do the rest.

Remember to adjust the valves before attempting to adjust the carburetors, and yes the valves can be adjusted with the engine in the chassis. it will be a bit of a pain to get the lash caps to release if it has been a while. USE A 6 POINT SOCKET OR BOX END WRENCH you will thank me later.

Since you can't hurt my feelings any I'll just assume your feelings can't be hurt either. Just quit giving out painfully bad advice.

~kop
 
kopcicle said:
Okay, just to be redundant, DO NOT USE A STEEL IMPLIMENT OF ANY KIND WHEN CLEANING CARBURETOR JETS. I use the fine wire from a household apleince cord. it's small enough and soft enough to not cause damage to a pilot jet. Once you can get the wire though chemical cleaners can do the rest.

Remember to adjust the valves before attempting to adjust the carburetors, and yes the valves can be adjusted with the engine in the chassis. it will be a bit of a pain to get the lash caps to release if it has been a while. USE A 6 POINT SOCKET OR BOX END WRENCH you will thank me later.

Since you can't hurt my feelings any I'll just assume your feelings can't be hurt either. Just quit giving out painfully bad advice.

~kop

Lol...can't quit doing what I haven't done.

Just to be redundant, its perfectly fine to use a steel wire from a wire wheel . . all my bikes and cars run just fine and have since i started working on them 45 years ago.


D
 
Then it's lucky everyone has your skill. You think a newbie with a steel wire will know how much to remove?


Just cause you have been doing it wrong without consequence does not mean it is a good idea or good to recommend.
 
Mydlyfkryzis said:
Then it's lucky everyone has your skill. You think a newbie with a steel wire will know how much to remove?


Just cause you have been doing it wrong without consequence does not mean it is a good idea or good to recommend.

Dear Nancy, it requires the skill of a dead cat to keep from damaging a jet or carb passage with a steel wire but obvious on it you lack that skill, lol.

In fact, its nearly impossible to damage a jet or carb with a steel wire and most people would have to put in a diligent effort to do so.

Please keep up your feeble attempts to be sarcastic, I haven't laughed this much since your first post although I have heard much better from 4th graders but don't give up hope...or your day job.
 
Use those "carb cleaner tools" that look like torch tip cleaners, they are like little round hard files... those suckers really get the gunk out!!! hell you can even increase jet size with em if yer "CAREFUL" :-\ :-\ :-\ :-\

Really, if chemicals wont soften it up its likely rust lodged or corrosion, rust needs to be removed in exactly the direction it was introduced and sometimes the best tool will the backside of a jewelers drill (tiny drill bits) but only to push something out you can see and can push from the back side opposite where it came from... never go rooting around in the passages with a chink of crincled up old ass wire wheel shit :eek:
 
Take Kop's advice. Period. While is is certainly possible to use steel implements to open blocked passageways without damage, it is dreadfully bad advice to do so, and comprehensively unnecessary. Your bike is already running half way right, so the need to poke anything through any of the passageways is pretty unlikely. Carb cleaner in a spray can and understanding what you are doing should be all that is needed. Half the carbs I have seen that were "professionally rebuilt by a bike shop so I know they are not the problem" - were the problem.

It is not that hard, and vast tuning knowledge is not needed. Just some willingness to understand a few basics, and a close look at the carbs so you understand what all the passageways do so you can have confidence that they are all clean and working.

The main thing to know is not obvious to the casual viewer. It may look like a simple device, where fuel from the bowl gets sucked up into the venturi which is the main bore of the carb by the air rushing by on its way into the engine. While this is true, it is not that simple. It is not fuel being sucked up into the venturi, but fuel AND air, which are premixed before they get to the venturi. Realizing this is the key to understanding what the passageways do and methodically checking each is clean.

Typically, there are two system or circuits that meter fuel and air into the venturi, and they both work the same way. The pilot system is for small throttle openings and main for large. In the pilot system air is provided through a small opening in the intake trumpet. This passageway leads past the pilot air screw, which serves as an adjustable jet for the volume of air used in the mix. The passageway continues to the air chamber that surrounds the pilot jet emulsion tube, where the air mixes with the fuel supplied by the pilot jet. If you look at the pilot jet you can see it is actually two devices. The jet part which is just the hole size in one end which meters the amount of fuel that is able to pass through from the fuel bowl. Fuel passes straight through this part from one end to the other. Fuel does not flow through the numerous holes along the length of the tubular section. That section is the emulsion tube, and air provided by the air chamber surrounding it allows air into the tube from outside it to mix with the fuel as it gets sucked through the pilot jet. Now you have a froth of air and fuel carefully metered by the pilot jet and the air screw that flows out the other end of the pilot jets emulsion tube into a passageway that leads to an opening in the venturi near the engine side of the throttle (slide). So follow the path of the air and know you have it perfectly clean by spraying carb cleaner into the passageways just like the air would travel through. See it spray out where you expect. Follow this process for the entire circuit until you are spraying carb cleaner into the venturi from the pilot jets location. The main system works exactly like the pilot, except the parts are larger, there is a fixed air jet that replaces the air screw, and the port into the venturi is made adjustable by a tapered needle attached to the throttle. Air enters the main system through another small opening in the intake bell, travels through a passageway to an air jet (usually permanent ) and then to a chamber where the main emulsion tube goes. Unlike the pilot jets which are attached to their emulsion tubes, the main jets have separate emulsion tubes so they can be changed to suit specific engine requirements. Fuel flows through the main jet, through the emulsion tube where air is also sucked in, and the resulting mixture combines with the air stream rushing through the venturi. Like the pilot jet, the main jet is submerged in the fuel in the fuel bowl. The bottom of the emulsion tubes are also submerged, and you can see that if the fuel level is too high or to low, holes in the emulsion tubes are either covered or exposed resulting in either a rich or lean fuel mix. So the fuel level is important.

So follow the path of air and fuel and clean and inspect each one, one at a time. It is not at all as bad as it might seem with my explanation. After examining the first carb the rest will be easy. Realize one certainty: No amount of boiling in miracle brew or years in an ultrasonic cleaner is a substitute for manually spraying through every passageway and witnessing the clean blast out the other side. Do that, and KNOW it will work perfectly!

One last thing. I heavily recommend that you retain ALL of your brass from your original carbs. Clean them and put them back in. They do not wear out, are known to be the right thing, and almost certainly manufactured to a much higher standard than the ones in the carb kit. Use the seals and gaskets, pitch the rest. The exception are the needles, but unless yours are obviously worn or damaged, keep them and put them back. If you think you need to replace them, get new ones from the manufacturer, and pitch the ones in the kit.
 
barnett468

I just lump this kind of dedicated and purposeful ignorance into the same bucket along with "pods" on CV carbs , Coker Firestone replicas as performance tires , hitting float bowls with a hammer to un-stick floats , 1980 owner's manual air pressure in tires made last month , drag pipes , drop seat hard tails , and the tooth fairy .

More important than what you choose to do on your own is what you suggest others do . I'll defend to extremis your right to express an opinion here . However I will not tolerate wilful ignorance . I'll admit that it can take a concerted effort to abuse carburettor brass with a steel implement but it can also take a minor gouge to disturb the flow characteristics of a main , intermediate or pilot jet . It is near impossible to damage a carburettor jet with a single strand of #32 copper .

This is no longer about who is right its about what is right . Remember we are the knowledge base here . No matter what we do to our own the advice we give to new riders and mechanics must be the very best that we have to offer . I will not tolerate any less .

~kop
 
As much as I hate to do it, I'm gonna have to go with barnett on this one... sort of.

I think the steel wire from a brush isn't a great idea, as they tend to kink and bend and snap pretty easily, but I regularly use the high E string from a guitar for cleaning jets and I've had no noticeably ill effects...

I'm at least willing to admit that it's not the only way or best way to do it, but I've had good results so far.
 
But the point is you can use anything you want...but recommending it to a neophyte is poor judgement. Imho.
 
Most E strings are not steel. When they are, they are coated with a polymer to resist corrosion. Guitar strings can be either bronze, steel, nickel, or phosphor-bronze. Phosphor-bronze and bronze are the most common because of warmer tones and corrosion resistance.
 
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