CD175 Honda "Baby Tracker"

pacomotorstuff

Coast to Coast
Hi everybody,
Got on a picture taking jag the other day while I was shooting some photos of parts I've got for sale and thought, what the heck, haven't kept up to date with where I'm at on the "Baby Tracker" Honda CD175 my daughter and I started ages ago.
Have made a bit of progress in the frame department - pretty much what you see is where I'm leaving it, am sanding the years of rust and DPO paint jobs off what is left of the original frame as well as prepping the new bits at the same time. We were originally going to powdercoat, then looked at plating, will go back to our original plan of silver metallic frame and stay with thechromed fenders and black (CF) seat and tank that we already have.
Anyway, have a look at the photos and see what you think; I'm always open to comments and suggestions.
Probably keep me busy this winter, between this and the XV café, which I'm trying to have ridable by June.
Have a Happy Holiday Season.
Pat

Right side profile view


Top Rear View


Boxed frame backbone


Left Side Frame Repair and Swingarm Plate


Rear shock mount and seat mount detail


Rear subframe / front frame top tube marryup and reinforcement
 
Hi everyone,
I was going to add a few notes on the frame modifications I did to the photos I already posted - info on the methods and materials I used, why I did it, etc., but found that I've written nearly 3 pages of notes - too long I think to post!
But, if anyone wants the details, email me and I'll send you a copy of my notes.
Happy Holidays,
Pat
pacomotorstuff@cogeco.ca
 
Hi all,
Was going to shoot a few photos of my progress, but found the shared camera is at work again, so maybe tonight or tomorrow?
I'm moving at my usual "glacial" pace on this project, but did manage to get the frame and swing arm primed and painted with hi-solids Dura-cryl in a shade called "nickel".
I did some very careful assembly over the last couple of days since the paint is still really, really fresh:
- rubber mounted the rear fender (originally, it was a '68 BSA front fender),
- rubber mounted the HD performance 6V coil using a couple of aerospace-grade Adel clamps (I have the correct capacitor to use with it),
- did a test fit of the left frame side cover so I could finalize the rubber mounts (because I'm using CL175 head pipes, it's going to be a semi-permanent installation and I'll access the battery and electrics from the right side),
- had the CF tank and seat on and off about a 100 times so I could go "ooh" and "aah" at my progress. I'm using stock Honda factory "hockey pucks" for the front tank mount and will either use a stock Honda rear tank mount or a rubber block of my own devising,
- mounted the CB350 swing arm that my frame has been modified to accept. I used bronze bushings and it seems the fixturing device I built to maintain the frame "trueness" during fabrication and welding worked very well. After ample greasing, the swing arm needed a light push to get it into position, the pivot bolt was a very light driving fit and the NOS Redwing shocks (330mm) slipped into place with very little effort.
Still a thousand things to do on the project it seems, but my plan is to keep working on the roller and get it out of the (heated) basement shop and into the garage for engine installation sometime in April.
I'll try to get some photos in a day or 2.
Pat
 
From the ass end; the ratty, tatty '68 Beezer front fender I'm using for the rear.


Close up of the right side swingarm pivot. Uses CB350 dust covers and end caps.


The boxed frame. I may paint the inside of the frame flat or satin black to make the lightening holes more visible.


All dressed up with the CF tank and seat. Check out that crazy rear brake stay, made from a piece of steel
from a WWII aircraft hangar in 1969 by yours truly (ya, some of the holes don't quite line up - I was 17 and
the drill press was a lot older than me).


Left side with the CF sidecover temporarily bolted in place.
 
Hi All,
Been nearly 9 months since I posted anything on the Baby Tracker, so I've posted a few (not very good) photos to show where I'm at.
Its up on wheels now. The photos show a "mule" set of engine cases in the bike with an output shaft and countershaft sprocket installed to get the correct chain alignment so I could get the axle spacers machined up - the joys of using a CD175 frame, a CB350 swing arm and a CB175 rear hub. The spacers look and work great, BTW.
I've tightened up the engine mounting tolerances by drilling and reaming the bolt holes, building new front engine plates and using aircraft (AN) bolts wherever I can, pondering why Honda made the mounting holes a lot larger diameter than the bolts. I was advised by my machinist not to do the final installation "tweeks" until the motor I'm using is in the frame - some fairly big production tolerances I guess?
I had the WM3X18 shouldered alloy back wheel laced and trued ages ago (the rim came pre-drilled) and mounted and balanced the tire.
The WM2X18 shouldered front alloy rim came undrilled - not available from my supplier drilled to fit a disc brake hub - so had to drill it myself. After vacillating forever, made a simple drill jig to get the correct spoke angles in the rim and drilled it in about an hour. I laced it up and had a friend do the final truing after I ran out of patience.
The spokes were painted with black epoxy and the rear spokes especially seem to chip easily and will need a respray; next time, powdercoat.
I've included a couple of photos of the cylinder and cylinder head. The cylinder is painted with high gloss black engine enamel, the idea being to make it look like a Brit cylinder - maybe a Triumph?
I'm using a CB175 dual carb head (the CD175 was a single carb) with a pair of flea market refugee Triumph 350 / 500 finned exhaust clamps modified to fit. The exhaust clamps were in really rough shape - one of them was cracked - so welding, grinding, machining and lots of fiddling to get them to work on the Honda.
The finned rocker covers started out as Joker Machine CRF150 parts (I think). The stock Honda rocker covers were machined and threaded to take the Joker finned parts, bonded together with high temperature permanent thread locker / sealant and staked together on the inside of the caps where you can't see it. To set the valve clearance, the covers will unthread out of the head like normal.
The intake manifolds are SL175 Honda and the carbs are both CD175 units - 22 mm if I remember correctly. The first time I offered up the carbs to the head was yesterday, so if it looks like some of the nuts and bolts are dodgey - you're right, they are - just wanted to assemble the bits for the photos and check frame clearances. The velocity stacks won't fit on the bike - I've got foam sock filters but haven't finalized the air filter mounts yet.
Starting in on the final engine assembly shortly; have changed out the 4 speed for a 5 speed, have heavy duty valve and clutch springs, all new valvetrain components, a rebore, a CB200 oil pump and a bunch of other stuff I'll show you in the next update.
Hope you like the photos.
Have a Happy Holiday Season and a Prosperous 2015
Pat
 
the bike looks great ;) what i don't understand is why you have the front end lowerd is that purely for stance ?
 
Hi X,
I'm using CB350 forks, which are about 2 inches longer than the CB175 forks and when the tube is level with the top crown, feels like too much trail. I dropped the front end down where the steering feels about normal to me, just pushing the bike around, but of course I 'll have to make final adjustments after I ride the bike.
There is a post somewhere on the site on how to make the sliders move up the tubes - add bits at one place and take away at another - and maybe I'll do it eventually as long as it doesn't affect the fork's damping and travel.
Another thing that I thought about was using a CNC'ed upper crown like Bullitt Bros makes - it would be a damned sight stiffer and doesn't have the drop like the stock crown so the tubes move up another 1-1/4" or so - but it doesn't have handlebar mounting provisions either, being meant for clip ons.
I guess I could shorten the fork tubes, but that might be as a last resort.
Sliding the tubes up fouled the handlebars, so if you look closely, you'll see I had to modify the handlebar mounts and move them back for clearance, which was a paint in the ass all by itself as I found out that the rubber handlebar mount bushings were not only there to dampen vibration but also allow for manufacturing tolerances.
A bunch of my friends dirt track and I was over at their shop recently; all of their race bikes had the tubes north of the upper crowns by varying degrees - everybody seems to like their bike to handle a bit differently.
BTW, thanks for the question - the whole idea of posting an update on the bike was to elicit comments, questions and observations regarding the build.
Pat
 
Hi everybody,
Between work and other projects, I've been slowly burning down the "to do" list on the tracker. Still lots of little stuff to do - finishing up the wiring, build a muffler bracket, battery box and figure out what front turn signals to use, fit up the Triumph pegs with Bates rubbers to the Honda mounts, stuff like that.
Give me a shout if there is anything you're curious about.
Enjoy the pictures.
Pat
 

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Great looking bike.. love the details.. What is the deal with those tappet covers?
 
The size of the tank, seat and bodywork has me scratching my head, and the frontend just doesn't work at all. I would have to change those things. There is too much frame showing, even for a "tracker". It's hard for me to tell you this because I can see how much work you have into those items, but you asked for insight so there is mine.

Also not much for the latest trend of drilling hundreds of tiny holes in aluminum covers or bracket that are already light. All the holes combined on this build might have saved you a pound, and they don't look good. I can't wait till the trend stops.

That being said, there are a lot of cool mods on your bike and you do really good work. I see things there that I cannot do. The exhaust is my favorite.
 
Hi guys,
Regarding the tappet covers, when I was a kid in the '60's, the best looking Triumphs had aftermarket finned tappet covers as a custom accessory. I saw them on road racers, flat trackers and choppers. I think the idea was to get additional cooling when the oil was thrown up into the covers or some such but probably it was just the "cool" factor.
Our first kick at the can for the finned covers, was to adapt a set of Triumph ones from the '60's but "no room at the inn" to marry up with the Honda head - ie, not enough meat in the old parts to remachine to fit on the Honda head.
Plan B, which I still may do one day, was to make up foundry patterns, get a bunch cast up and machined for the bike (I had a job as a foundry pattern maker when I was working my way through university and can still get 'er done when I have to).
Plan C, which you see in the photos, was an easier and cheaper solution. I managed to get a set of Joker Machine tappet covers cheap on ebay - I think they were for a CRF150, but no one, including the seller, was quite sure. We machined and threaded the Honda covers to take the finned covers and bonded the parts together with high temperature thread locker / sealant and so far, the bees' knees. I think the only thing I would have done differently, was to get them sand blasted first, so they would more like a casting rather than a CNC machined part.
DOHC, regarding the bodywork, the tank started as a XR75 Honda and is almost the same size and capacity as the short track / sprint tank I had on my dirt tracker about 30 years ago (I still have the tracker tank mould and I was amazed how close they are in size). On a Saturday night at my local short track, aka "The Vicious Circle", I could do practice, heat, semi - and on those really rare occasions that I transferred to the main LOL, run the final, all on one tank of gas. I guess what I was trying to do, when I put the little tank on the bike, was imitate the style of the old dirt trackers I used to race and as one of my chums opined, that bike probably gets 80 miles to the gallon, so not a huge issue, capacity-wise.
Same goes for the seat. The seat was originally designed and used on Viper, Champion, Panther Racing and Curtis-framed purpose-built dirt trackers back in the '70's and you still see the odd one at a dirt track today. The mould I made the CF seat base from has some real history up here in Canada, as parts made from it were on Canadian dirt track champions' motorcycles in the '70's and '80's. On the Baby Tracker, I shortened it a little bit up front since the CD frame is shorter than the tracker frames, but the rear frame jig I made to lay in the tubes was based on this seat, so it all blends together pretty good IMHO.
Unusual comment regarding "lightening holes". I never really considered it a "trend", as I've seen it on race bikes for well over 50 years (got dragged to races as a kid and am I ever really, really thankful for that). What I was trying to do, again, was replicate the race bikes as I remember them from the '60's and '70's, when the only high tech materials available were fiberglass, aluminum and... a drilled hole. As far as it "not working", I guess, each to his / her own; I like it just fine.
But keep the comments and questions coming - it's great - helps me get a bead on who is building what these days.
Best regards,
Pat
 
i like a lot the tail ,wheels,and seat, pipes etc very nice .. the frame mods look rerally well done.....but the tank is too small,too short the front tire too fat and it needs about 2" lift/more fork travel the pegs would suit better i think for riding being moved back 4" and raised a scoatch the holes don't bother me they are definately authentic period correct mod..i have seen some scary overholed brake stays tho, ouch , but yours looks stillsturdy
 
I realize lightening holes have been around forever. That doesn't mean it isn't a current and commonly misapplied trend. Lightening holes are for racing, not to make a bike "look the part". The theme should be carried or abandoned.

This is a discussion regarding the heart and soul of motorcycling, the fact that through these machines we can express ourselves in one way or another. It's like I tell my buddies, you do your thing, it only makes me look better. LOL.

I may steal your exhaust shield design for my cl175 ;D
 
DOHC,
The bike is a 1971, so if some poor, misguided fool was going to dirt track one of these "things" well over 40 years ago, probably, pretty much would look like the bike I built except for the CF LOL. I get what you mean, if an 80's superbike has swisscheesed parts hanging off it, looks pretty dweeby.
X,
I know what you mean about the front end - it "looks" short to me, too. Using a 350 fork on the 175 is a bit of a compromise - I think the tube offset isn't that good for the bike and if I had to do it again, might have used one of the sets of Marzocchis in the shop or something else but... throwing the bike around, as the front end sits right now, feels pretty good; a tiny bit twitchy, a little aggressively quick, but ...nice. Depends how you ride as well; I was never a guy who liked his bike to let him know what was happening, 2 days later, if you get my drift.
Funny you should say the front tire looks too big; I was just of the opposite mind. We had 4.00's front and back on the Staracer 125 and a fellow I know who built a little rigid framer runs 4.00 X18's front and back and seems to be the bomb. I almost ordered up a WM3 for the front after I saw his bike, but his is strictly dirt and mine should be on the soon and need a little more precise steering.
Keep the comments coming - that's what this club is all about.
Pat
 
the fat tire up front kills a bit of every aspect of perfomance simply because of the unneeded extra mass/weight ....c'mon you know better that is a tire size suited for a lot heavier bike....now it may work better putting along in soft sand that is all.... and you have sacrificed quite a bit by restricting the front travel, looks being one of them
 
X,
Haven't shortened the travel. The forks have 100% of the stroke that God and Honda gave it - all 4-1/2 inches if I read and converted the numbers in the manual correctly. The forks are dropped in the yokes for handling, not for "style".
I stopped worrying about "style" about the same time I stopped worrying about what people thought about the scars on my face - first, from when I used to box and after that, from crashing.
I understand what you say about fat front tires slowing down the steering, but honestly, the steering doesn't feel slow at all. I guess I could have put Firestones on the bike and really got people boned, but after unloading off a bike with those "things" on the rims nearly 50 years ago, then again, maybe not...
BTW, have you ever dirt tracked or ridden in the dirt - even gone for a trail ride? Just wondered.
Yer a hoot, buddy.
Pat
 
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