CL360 engine build questions

Or just send your carbs to PJ and have him work some magic on them and run K&N filters.
 
deviant said:
Or just send your carbs to PJ and have him work some magic on them and run K&N filters.
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When you say K&N filters do you mean stock filter replacement or the pod style filters? I'm learning the PJ must be a God on this forum.
 
K&N RU or RC 1820 pods. He does really good work on the 360 carbs, no doubt. He did mine, and the change is very noticeable on performance.
 
LiveStoked said:
When you say K&N filters do you mean stock filter replacement or the pod style filters? I'm learning the PJ must be a God on this forum.
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Nope, I'm just the only person dumb enough to put time into CB/CJ250/360 and find out what works ;D
It was always the 'red headed stepchild' of the Honda lineup, the 'upgrades' made it a less reliable motor than the 350. If you hunt about a bit you'll see what needs to be done to make it reliable and reasonably quick (for a 40yr old 2 valve four stroke ;) )
Cam looks like it had rocker arm dig in during a re-build, looks like a definite 'notch'? I would look for a good used one, cheaper than getting it welded and re-ground (although that is an option)
Unless your racing, the stock cam is all you need for the road.
If pistons look good, they are, very long skirt so doesn't 'rock' in bore. I would just check ring end gaps and free end gap (Honda doesn't give a spec but it will be around 8~9mm)
Need to check piston to cylinder clearance -use Honda specs
When they are running right 360's are a load of fun, they are much easier to ride at 'normal' speeds.

Couple of things you really DON'T want to do
Don't fit oversize tyres on stock rims, 80/90x18 front and 100/90 rear.
If you want tyres to look bigger, fit WM2 front rim , WM3 rear rim or WM3 rims both ends then use 90/90 front and 110/90 rear
Don't fit 30 or 32mm Mikuni's, unless you really, really like messing with carburetors and really, really want to learn how to ride all over again. (they are not as easy to tune as original carbs)
Really, Mikuni's need new slides, emulsion tubes, needles as well as several different pairs of main jets, realistically, around $250~$300 in parts after you buy the carbs. They can be made to work kinda OK but without major changes don't run as 'clean' as modified stock carbs
Don't fit cheap pods, they are just a waste of your money.
Get K&N (Uni's work but have lower flow rate and don't last as long as K&N)
You don't want to run parallel short pipes with internal or no baffles, 360's NEED a long exhaust
 
I'll stick with stock carbs then and modify them for K&N pods. What jets do I need to look you purchase?
The exhauat I planned on building was going to run down and out the sides by the back tire, almost like Buell style, but I guess that's a bad idea then? What is the reason for that? What exhaust do you recommend? What do you recommend for mufflers?
 
I think this will be muffler I run? Would this work properly? I can bend the exhaust to mount it where I would like. I'll change the plan to have this one muffler on the right side of the bike next to the swing arm.

http://www.dimecitycycles.com/vintage-cafe-racer-caferacer-bobber-brat-chopper-custom-motorcycle-exhaust-parts-stainless-steel-reverse-cone-shorty-motorcycle-muffler-80-1625.html
 
LiveStoked said:
The exhaust I planned on building was going to run down and out the sides by the back tire, almost like Buell style, but I guess that's a bad idea then? What is the reason for that? What exhaust do you recommend? What do you recommend for mufflers?
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You could do that if you made internal piping inside a box (like Buell and some sport bikes) the total length is the important bit, not how it's packaged.
They work out tuned length then fit internal plates and tubes to get best overall performance.
The reason Ducati 'invented' the underseat exhaust was probably styling but the increase in length helped power output. The computer technology and programs just weren't available in the 80's which is why they can now use short system that aids aerodynamics, even though it looks bulky as hell (and the stock Buell weighs 'a ton' ;D )
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Makes sense to have longer exhaust. I think I'll just purchase the muffler and run it down the side.

I'm making a shopping list and I'm just seeing if there's anything else I should get besides what is listed below...

Camshaft
Cam chain
Gasket set
Carb gaskets
Muffler
KN Filters

Any idea what size jets I should get for the carbs to work with the K&N?

Anything else you can think of that will get the motor built?
 
Send them to PJ. Trust me. He does more than just a re-jet. Less than $150 and it will be the best mod you'll do to the bike.
 
Bit pissed off at present, typed out a long semi technical explanation and ****** internet provider screwed me over (thank you for nothing Brighthouse Networks :mad: )
Just called them to complain and now it's working real good ::)
Anyway, basically, you can't jet out the problems with stock carbs.
When jetted correctly for top end (107.5~125 secondary main jet) it gets so rich at transition (around 4,500rpm) it may cut out when you get to 6~7,000rpm
You can't use the various fixes used for 2 jet slide carbs posted all over.
I've spent literally years messing with various things and different circuits to find out what happens when, it all has to be done on rpm not throttle position with CV carbs
 
crazypj said:
Bit pissed off at present, typed out a long semi technical explanation and ****** internet provider screwed me over (thank you for nothing Brighthouse Networks :mad: )
Just called them to complain and now it's working real good ::)
Anyway, basically, you can't jet out the problems with stock carbs.
When jetted correctly for top end (107.5~125 secondary main jet) it gets so rich at transition (around 4,500rpm) it may cut out when you get to 6~7,000rpm
You can't use the various fixes used for 2 jet slide carbs posted all over.
I've spent literally years messing with various things and different circuits to find out what happens when, it all has to be done on rpm not throttle position with CV carbs
Click to expand...

kinda makes a feller ah'preciate what a good job they done getting that complicated machine, the cv carb , to work so well out the doe,wonder how many hours of testing? ,do you suppose it was keihin technicians or honda techs what dialed in a particular carb set per model?
 
Pretty sure Honda told Kei-Hin what they wanted then had to work together to make a carb that worked. It was pretty much when new fuel consumpion and exhaust emissions were being mandated. Honda always want to be one step ahead of legislation and ended up with a completely new design of carb based on the 350 twin carb (but MUCH more difficult to modify) Things got a lot worse in 77~78 when the new style carbs were designed (CB400~900 style 3 jet) Even Honda and Kei-Hin couldn't make them work for super bike racing (had to keep stock carbs with internal modifications)
They got Leon Moss to make things work (LEDAR Race Developments) He's the guy who invented Kawasaki 'FARTS' (Fresh Air Ram Technology Systems ;D ) Kawasaki never noticed during development as it was always written out in full on a single line. It was only when marketing dept put it on fairing it became obvious ;D ;D 8)
 
Sounds like you just need a bike that runs and doesn't leave your girlfriend broken down at a stop light.

Personally.... In that situation. Stock Pistons. Stock carbs. I think mikunis are easier to tune but that probably just depends on the person and experience. Yes you will have to experiment with jets on either set of carbs.

If I was building my girlfriend/wife a wife I would spend my money on brakes .
 
Mikuni's may SEEM easier to tune because there are less parts, but, to tune properly so they work as well as stock modified is a LOT more difficult. I only have about 46 yrs working on various motorcycles, tech, service writer, service manager, self employed, etc ;D
 
So tomorrow is the day that I get down into the transmission area to inspect and clean the area up. I plan on disassembling the rest of the motor tomorrow, ordering the parts I need, then paint or polish the motor parts as I wait for other parts. Anything I should look for as I tear down? Recommendations on paint for the case and what not? The bike is planned to be a black/gold/polished metal themed bike, any recommendations you have just send them my way!

For reassembly, is there anything that I need to pay close attention to? Any parts I need to inspect closer? I'm just making sure I put this thing back together the correct way. This is my first rebuild so it seems a little overwhelming at times. I don't want to mess anything up!

PJ, I still gotta send the carbs to you. Me and the other half had a anniversary weekend so now I'm just waiting to get my money right to send them to you!
 
dont get carried away with cleaning things like the transmission parts clutch and crankshaft
as long as the motor was running with clean and not gritty oil just bag those parts and re-install after inspection
 
+1, leave those parts oily from removal.
I use diesel for most of the parts, any water based cleaner is too likely to make parts corrode/oxidise (all modern diesel fuels have a high detergent level)
May need to use simple green first on crankcase, cylinders and head but spray down with WD 40, particularly though valve guides ASAP (and any other steel parts)
 
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