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Author Topic: 1974 Honda CB360 - Complete winter tear down (VERY pic heavy)  (Read 17891 times)

Offline mrjoshzombie

  • Posts: 147
I'm a sucker for build logs, so I figured I'd make one for the CB360 as well. This is my first motorcycle I've ever rode (for all of an hour) or owned (I don't even have my permit yet). The one good thing is I'm dating a Harley tech, so she'll be able to guide me through a lot of this bike.

Motorcycle: 1974 Honda CB360
Miles: 18,457.8
Purchase Price: $840
The Goods:
• Runs
• Is complete from what I can tell
• Nearly Stock
• Ignition Coils Replaced
• New Points
• Came with a carb rebuild kit
• Minimal Rust

Issues:

• Rough start up
It usually takes a few kicks, and the electric start struggles to get it going from a cold start, but I'm associating this to a nearly dead battery. Once the bike is warmed up it starts back up no problems. I had to jump it once and it cranked right over, even being cold, so I'm just assuming the battery either needs replaced or just charged steadily.

• Backfiring and popping in the right exhaust while cold
It seems the left chamber is getting the most of the power. The muffler pushes out stronger, hotter air then the right. Once the engine is warmed up, this seems to be less of an issue, but is still somewhat problematic. It originally had a high idle, but messing with the idle screw solved that and keeps at a steady 1,200 RPM or so.

• RPMs "stick" until bike is shifted
Every now and then, the RPMS will just randomly stick and stay at about 5k RPM. If I shift into the next gear, it'll smooth back out. However, if I'm neutral while idling, it'll stay at the 5 grand fairly steadily until I either mess with the idle screw again, or shut the bike off.

• Horn doesn't work
Either the wire is toast somewhere, or the horn is just dead. Easy to diagnose at least.

• Turn signals stopped blinking
I'm associated this one with a low battery.

• Recall work was never done
I see no stamp on my engines VIN, so it appears the recall was never taken care of. I'll have to sort that out.

Goals:
Over this winter pull the engine to degrease, paint and tune up. It has a few leaks, so all the gaskets will be replaced and screw heads replaced with stainless steel bolts. Look into doing the recall work myself. Clean and sync the carbs and work on the petcock to get it to stop leaking. All the hoses need replaced, front forks need rebuilt, and new tires are in order. If I can get the motor running in tip-top shape and maintenance done, then move onto aesthetics.

This includes new clips ons, rear sets with linkage, update all the lighting to LED, replace the engine harness, new grips, and do some body work on my gas tank. Re-lace the wheels including painting or powder coating the rims and hubs. Basically, clean the whole body up and move it slowly to the cafe look while keeping function above aesthetics.

Now that wall of text is over, just a shot of the bike from when I brought it home.



I'll be keeping up to date with this log and attempting to always use my Nikon for clear photos. I look forward to harassing everyone for assistance. :D
« Last Edit: Dec 17, 2013, 12:04:29 by mrjoshzombie »
1974 Honda CB360 - Winter Café Build

Offline mrjoshzombie

  • Posts: 147
Re: 1974 Honda CB360 - Winter Restore to Café Racer (eventually)
« Reply #1 on: Nov 09, 2013, 18:35:06 »
It was a lovely day so I decided to pull the bike out for a quite ride around the block. On initial startup there was an EXTREMELY loud backfire or two, and then things calmed down a bit. Only rode for about a mile (just warming the engine up) and adjusted the idle to around 1kRPM and noticed some smoke out of the breather, how normal is this for a 40 year old bike?

I took a quick video of the engine running to get some opinions on what I should be tackling first.

1974 Honda CB360 - Winter Café Build

Offline trek97

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Re: 1974 Honda CB360 - Winter Restore to Café Racer (eventually)
« Reply #2 on: Nov 10, 2013, 21:28:05 »
nice little vid.  Its hard to hear in vids,  Is it smoke or just condensation vapor?  Looks like vapor to me.
 maybe just a valve and cam chain adjustment.  But if your gonna rip her open soon I dont think I would even bother w that.
I dont see any smoke from the exhaust.   
If your gonna ride her anymore this fall make sure to get fresh oil in her.  I mean RIGHT NOW.
Rotella 5w40 synthetic (blue bottle) ONLY for now...
after the rebuild you will run the Rotella and add a bit of ZDDP additive to it.  ONLY
« Last Edit: Mar 13, 2015, 20:15:55 by trek97 »

Offline mrjoshzombie

  • Posts: 147
Re: 1974 Honda CB360 - Winter Restore to Café Racer (eventually)
« Reply #3 on: Nov 11, 2013, 11:00:29 »
nice little vid.  Its hard to hear in vids,  Is it smoke or just condensation vapor?  Looks like vapor to me.
 maybe just a valve and cam chain adjustment.  But if your gonna rip her open soon I dont think I would even bother w that.
I dont see any smoke from the exhaust.   
If your gonna ride her anymore this fall make sure to get fresh oil in her.  I mean RIGHT NOW.
Rotella 5w40 synthetic (blue bottle) ONLY for now...
after the rebuild you will run the Rotella and add a bit of ZDDP additive to it.  ONLY

I offer the manuals you need free on my blog...

http://www.hondabrat.com/2013/04/manuals.html

Is this the thread your gonna stick w now?  I am seeing you got a few started.


Yup, this is the main thread I'll be staying in. The other was just an introduction and then a few questions about the engine itself, but this one will have all the info on the build.

That was actually the last day I planned to have the bike running before Spring. I just wanted to take it out one last time, make a few notes, take that video to see how it was originally running, and make my game plan with it. I'm going to pull the top end off of it and take a look at the rings and see if they need replaced.

I decided to drag the motorcycle into my kitchen so I actually have a warm area to work on it this winter. Started to tear parts off of it and took apart the crankcase cover to see inside. It actually looks amazingly clean.













The oil needed changed BADLY, but it was completely full and everything looks solid. I cleaned out the screen and will be ordering a new gasket to button it back up again. Also, I want to thank frogman for the suggestion on the Harbor Freight impact screw driver set. It made VERY quick work on the screws that held in the crankcase.

I noticed this while stripping the bike down as well...


That's a good ignition system, right? I think I saw somewhere on one of these forums that's a solid upgrade. Certainly made me happy to see it.

I'll be ordering my engine bolt kit today, because I screwed up a few removing them, and noticed a few missing:


Carbs came off.


Parts are piling up:


And this is where the bike sits for now:


I pulled the spark plugs and they were COVERED in carbon. No white what-so-ever, just completely black (forgot to grab pics) so that gives me an idea in tuning at least. Carbs are being torn apart and rebuilt by my Harley tech of a girlfriend, I picked up checko's tank and seat that I'll be doing some modifications to, and will be ordering some parts today.

I plan to paint the engine at some point, but realized I wanted to get all new hardware for it. How should I go about painting? Install the old screws/bolts, paint it, then remove them and replace with stainless steel? Or should I just use masking tape and paint each part individually? I can't think of what's going to be the easiest.
1974 Honda CB360 - Winter Café Build

Offline Green199

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Re: 1974 Honda CB360 - Winter Restore to Café Racer (eventually)
« Reply #4 on: Nov 11, 2013, 11:10:08 »
In terms of it sticking at 5 thou RPM, that has all the signs of a vacuum leak. Check the carb boots for small cracks all the way around the base. Its easy to check when the bike is running, as you can just spray some starter fluid onto the boots and see if the motor revs more. As you are taking it apart and probably not having it running again for the time being, Id just replace the boots.

And its always best to paint the motor parts individually once stripped.

Good luck, will be following this.
1973 CB250 'Doing it right this time round' - http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=36795.0

Offline Sonreir

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Re: 1974 Honda CB360 - Winter Restore to Café Racer (eventually)
« Reply #5 on: Nov 11, 2013, 11:15:49 »
I'll follow along.

The Dyna is a good ignition system, definitely, but I don't recommend it for the 350 or 360.  3 ohm coils just draw too much current compared to what the bike is capable of generating.  You have a 110 watt alternator.  Those coils are pulling about 100 watts at 100% duty cycle.  So yeah... that could be part of you electrics problem.
Sparck Moto - http://www.sparckmoto.com

Audaces fortuna iuvat.

1977 Honda CJ360 - Café SOS - Stage One™, Café SOS - Stage Two™
1976 Puch Maxi - APuchalypse Now
Suzi T500 Cobra Resto

Custom Gauge Graphics
Custom Wiring Harnesses

DTT Red, White, and/or Black 360 Club - Better than those Blue guys

Offline mrjoshzombie

  • Posts: 147
Re: 1974 Honda CB360 - Winter Restore to Café Racer (eventually)
« Reply #6 on: Nov 11, 2013, 11:21:29 »
In terms of it sticking at 5 thou RPM, that has all the signs of a vacuum leak. Check the carb boots for small cracks all the way around the base. Its easy to check when the bike is running, as you can just spray some starter fluid onto the boots and see if the motor revs more. As you are taking it apart and probably not having it running again for the time being, Id just replace the boots.

And its always best to paint the motor parts individually once stripped.

Good luck, will be following this.

The carbs are in pieces right now but I'll check the boots for any signs of wear on them. I can't imagine they're an expensive piece to replace at all.

That's what I was thinking as well in terms of paint, I just wanted to get other opinions as well before I take a crack it it. I'm about a month off from that point, but I want to start planning ahead.

I'll follow along.

The Dyna is a good ignition system, definitely, but I don't recommend it for the 350 or 360.  3 ohm coils just draw too much current compared to what the bike is capable of generating.  You have a 110 watt alternator.  Those coils are pulling about 100 watts at 100% duty cycle.  So yeah... that could be part of you electrics problem.

Do you have a recommendation for a different ignition system? I have no problems with pulling that out if there's a possibility it's giving me issues. I know I have a helluva time keeping the battery charged (I've had to jump it twice now) and it doesn't want to recharge from the bike running it seems.

I'll actually be PMing you later as I plan to rip the entire harness out and buy one built by you. I had contemplated building my own harness but the more I looked it at, the more overwhelming it became.
1974 Honda CB360 - Winter Café Build

Offline Sonreir

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Re: 1974 Honda CB360 - Winter Restore to Café Racer (eventually)
« Reply #7 on: Nov 11, 2013, 11:33:45 »
I think these should be higher resistance, but ask the seller.  He's a member here on the boards:
https://www.moto-madness.com/ignition-coils-c-342_826_829/universal-12v-ignition-coil-p-1541.html?zenid=0f15b374db2a936edc8b344258128f28
Sparck Moto - http://www.sparckmoto.com

Audaces fortuna iuvat.

1977 Honda CJ360 - Café SOS - Stage One™, Café SOS - Stage Two™
1976 Puch Maxi - APuchalypse Now
Suzi T500 Cobra Resto

Custom Gauge Graphics
Custom Wiring Harnesses

DTT Red, White, and/or Black 360 Club - Better than those Blue guys

Offline mrjoshzombie

  • Posts: 147
Re: 1974 Honda CB360 - Winter Restore to Café Racer (eventually)
« Reply #8 on: Nov 11, 2013, 11:51:45 »
Well, that's so much cheaper than I thought it would be! I'll be contacting them later today and pulling of the Dyna to sell later.

Looking at bolt kits and I'm trying to decide who to grab from. Obviously starting with supporting venders we have:

Bullit Custom Cycles - $41 - 64 Pieces
http://bullitcustomcycles.com/products/engine/honda-cb360-bolt-kit/?currency=USD

DCC - $39.95 (don't have my 100 posts yet so no discount haha) - Unknown pieces
http://www.dimecitycycles.com/vintage-cafe-racer-caferacer-bobber-brat-chopper-custom-motorcycle-hardware-stainless-steel-engine-nut-bolt-kit-honda-cb360-cl360-im-360-03a.html

Not site vendors:

AlloyBoltz - $38.95 - 116 Piece
http://alloyboltz.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=316_358_382&products_id=2182&osCsid=d2351be464ccb332843be85feaea3489

Hondacb360 - $40 - Unknown pieces
http://www.hondacb360.com/parts/engine-transmission/stainless-steel-bolt/

Anyone have specific experience with any of the individual kits? They're all around the same pricing so that's not a factor to me at all, just quality and over-all completeness.
« Last Edit: Nov 11, 2013, 11:55:30 by mrjoshzombie »
1974 Honda CB360 - Winter Café Build

Offline Sonreir

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Re: 1974 Honda CB360 - Winter Restore to Café Racer (eventually)
« Reply #9 on: Nov 11, 2013, 11:54:45 »
I run the AlloyBoltz one on my 360.  I'm pleased with it.

Make sure you use anti-seize when you install them or you'll have a bitch of a time getting them out later.  Dissimilar metals have a tendency to "weld" themselves together over time and aluminum/steel is a pretty bad combo.
Sparck Moto - http://www.sparckmoto.com

Audaces fortuna iuvat.

1977 Honda CJ360 - Café SOS - Stage One™, Café SOS - Stage Two™
1976 Puch Maxi - APuchalypse Now
Suzi T500 Cobra Resto

Custom Gauge Graphics
Custom Wiring Harnesses

DTT Red, White, and/or Black 360 Club - Better than those Blue guys