1962 BSA DBD34 Gold Star restoration (1000 miles and more)
- Thread starter swan
- Start date
Re: 1962 BSA DBD34 Gold Star restoration (New crankshaft arrived!!!!)
Bumpthump, thank you for the kind words. Everyone else sorry for the delays but Joe is right, I am eeking out every bit of riding before the snow flies (any day now). To the rest of you, (50gary) no one is going to touch this bike... I stare at it everyday, it is my screen saver on my phone and computers and I have not lost enthusiasm. Work, travel and life leave little to no free time for me, but again things will slow a bit starting this week.
Finding the time to prep the hardware for plating is kicking my ass. I made improvements to my POS bench top blasting cabinet with some additional lighting, new seals, silicone, filters and a $15 craigslist shopvac. I am slowly tackling the hardware in sections (tonight one of the gearboxes). Sending all my hardware out to be cad plated is making me nervous and I may zinc plate it all myself. If the box was lost, stolen misplaced etc it will sink the project. I have copy-cad chemicals from Caswell and a really cool vintage DC power source from a neighbor (former BSA and Triumph shop owner and a Goldie fanatic), have plated hardware for other motorcycles and my vintage Schwinn bicycle and may end up doing so for the Gold Star. Additionally, if I miss the odd piece or need to re-plate in the future I can do so myself. Hmmmm, should I go zinc or cadmium....
Freshly blasted.
Bumpthump, thank you for the kind words. Everyone else sorry for the delays but Joe is right, I am eeking out every bit of riding before the snow flies (any day now). To the rest of you, (50gary) no one is going to touch this bike... I stare at it everyday, it is my screen saver on my phone and computers and I have not lost enthusiasm. Work, travel and life leave little to no free time for me, but again things will slow a bit starting this week.
Finding the time to prep the hardware for plating is kicking my ass. I made improvements to my POS bench top blasting cabinet with some additional lighting, new seals, silicone, filters and a $15 craigslist shopvac. I am slowly tackling the hardware in sections (tonight one of the gearboxes). Sending all my hardware out to be cad plated is making me nervous and I may zinc plate it all myself. If the box was lost, stolen misplaced etc it will sink the project. I have copy-cad chemicals from Caswell and a really cool vintage DC power source from a neighbor (former BSA and Triumph shop owner and a Goldie fanatic), have plated hardware for other motorcycles and my vintage Schwinn bicycle and may end up doing so for the Gold Star. Additionally, if I miss the odd piece or need to re-plate in the future I can do so myself. Hmmmm, should I go zinc or cadmium....
Freshly blasted.
Re: 1962 BSA DBD34 Gold Star restoration (making progress)
In regard to what you just said: I agree. If you know the plater and can hand deliver the parts, it's a great scene. When you're dealing with almost unobtanium parts, I don't trust many actions to have the desired result.
In regard to what you just said: I agree. If you know the plater and can hand deliver the parts, it's a great scene. When you're dealing with almost unobtanium parts, I don't trust many actions to have the desired result.
Re: 1962 BSA DBD34 Gold Star restoration (making progress)
hi swan..well we had another nice day outside in mn! ha ha
anyhow i would suggest you go with brite cad plating. i can give you a place (and persons name) in pa who does nice work and has not lost any of my parts and lets face it anything you need for a bsa g/s is available, it's far from unobtainiam..
i lay it all out and then take photo's(3 or 4)call them, tell them to expect it, box it and include a note/contact information and ship....quality zinc is ok but that era bike had cad not zinc. cadwell kits do not hold up good enough. real cad lasts...
the other thing is cleaning i hate to do it also but one of the best ways is to wire wheel most of it (6 or 8 inch wheel) . when i worked at nwa i would glass bead it(as they had great equipment) and then go right to the plating shop, that was nice .but now i use a combination of glass,aluminum oxide blaster,a parts tumbler and a wire wheel since my shop equipment is not great .if you blast them leave the dust on it as it keeps it from rusting(a little) and keep everything dry or spray them with a rust preventative..
hi swan..well we had another nice day outside in mn! ha ha
anyhow i would suggest you go with brite cad plating. i can give you a place (and persons name) in pa who does nice work and has not lost any of my parts and lets face it anything you need for a bsa g/s is available, it's far from unobtainiam..
i lay it all out and then take photo's(3 or 4)call them, tell them to expect it, box it and include a note/contact information and ship....quality zinc is ok but that era bike had cad not zinc. cadwell kits do not hold up good enough. real cad lasts...
the other thing is cleaning i hate to do it also but one of the best ways is to wire wheel most of it (6 or 8 inch wheel) . when i worked at nwa i would glass bead it(as they had great equipment) and then go right to the plating shop, that was nice .but now i use a combination of glass,aluminum oxide blaster,a parts tumbler and a wire wheel since my shop equipment is not great .if you blast them leave the dust on it as it keeps it from rusting(a little) and keep everything dry or spray them with a rust preventative..
bikeboy
Over 1,000 Posts
Re: 1962 BSA DBD34 Gold Star restoration (making progress)
I get the best result (zinc plating) by glass beading, then running over the parts with a wire wheel. It puts a nice smooth finish on them, and gives the zinc a nice shiny-smooth texture.
Zinc plating at home is a no-brainer, but I'd personally be reluctant to try any of the other more complicated finishes.
keep plugging away at it
cheers
ian
cheers
ian
joea said:
I get the best result (zinc plating) by glass beading, then running over the parts with a wire wheel. It puts a nice smooth finish on them, and gives the zinc a nice shiny-smooth texture.
Zinc plating at home is a no-brainer, but I'd personally be reluctant to try any of the other more complicated finishes.
keep plugging away at it
cheers
ian
cheers
ian
Re: 1962 BSA DBD34 Gold Star restoration (making progress)
bike boy,same with cad and actually any plating, the better the prep work the better the final plating looks..
cad is the prefered plating for vintage british machines as that is the way they were delivered unlike the japanese machines which had zinc plated hardware. cad is the superior plating also and why it is used for aviation and aerospace parts and probably the only reason it is still around in the usa....epa is trying to outlaw it due to it's a heavy metal and bad for humans and enviroment...
what ever way you go just make sure the plater has a good reputation, as that is the biggest concern- does he do a good job,perform each step correctly and give you a quality part.
bike boy,same with cad and actually any plating, the better the prep work the better the final plating looks..
cad is the prefered plating for vintage british machines as that is the way they were delivered unlike the japanese machines which had zinc plated hardware. cad is the superior plating also and why it is used for aviation and aerospace parts and probably the only reason it is still around in the usa....epa is trying to outlaw it due to it's a heavy metal and bad for humans and enviroment...
what ever way you go just make sure the plater has a good reputation, as that is the biggest concern- does he do a good job,perform each step correctly and give you a quality part.
bikeboy
Over 1,000 Posts
Re: 1962 BSA DBD34 Gold Star restoration (making progress)
Yeah, I agree Joe, cad is much nicer. Didn't know it was OEM on brit bikes, but makes sense. I was just musing on the relative merits of home-plating, and while I have a zinc kit that turns out great stuff, the cad and other metal platings are more involved and temp/chemical critical, and in the end probably not worth the hassle. It's fantastically conventient to be able to pull a few bolts out, clean them up and plate them, and have 'em refitted within the hour
Good quality platers are also a dying breed over here, but if you manage to find one, then that's a relationship worth cultivating.
cheers
ian
joea said:
Yeah, I agree Joe, cad is much nicer. Didn't know it was OEM on brit bikes, but makes sense. I was just musing on the relative merits of home-plating, and while I have a zinc kit that turns out great stuff, the cad and other metal platings are more involved and temp/chemical critical, and in the end probably not worth the hassle. It's fantastically conventient to be able to pull a few bolts out, clean them up and plate them, and have 'em refitted within the hour
Good quality platers are also a dying breed over here, but if you manage to find one, then that's a relationship worth cultivating.
cheers
ian
Re: 1962 BSA DBD34 Gold Star restoration (making progress)
My tuppence worth. Be patient, and go cadmium. I say this not (only) because it's superior, but because you have started this with such an eye wateringly high standard of detail and finish. Now, i can't really explain this, because it's something you kind of have to see side by side. A British bike of this period with cadmium fittings looks very different to the same bike sporting zinc plated fittings. It's hard to explain, but if you can imagine an old brass screw head that's tens of years old, and has been worn and polished through years and years of contact, it becomes a thing of beauty. Compare it then to a brass screw bought from Home Depot yesterday. Both are essentially the same thing, both have the same metal at their core, yet one is utilitarian, while the other has a tactile "rightness" about it.
When you see the same bikes with zinc and cadmium, both are shiney and new, but deep down inside, you know that one has a look of expediency to it, whereas the other has a look of authenticity to it.
This bikes deserves (ok, demands) that you go the cadmium route. You're not in a race with anyone but yourself. Take the time to stay true to the standards that you have set. When I said your bike was on the way to being one of the best Goldies in the world, I meant it. It's you who has plotted the course. Don't let the nerves get the better of you. You're seeing what looks like a little zinc shortcut here, but you need set it aside, accept that the prep work has driven you nuts, and stay on the track that will reward you for your commitment.......and it genuinely isn't going to be found in zinc! You have said that this bike will never be for sale........so there's neither the need nor the rush to cut corners to maximize profit. As you've found, the devil resides in the detail, and doing the prep work has been that little dance with the devil. You just need to remember that in the finished bike, God resides in the detail too, and something as simple as cadmium plating your fittings is the kind of detail that will make all the difference in the world.....you'll know it when you've assembled it, believe me.
My tuppence worth. Be patient, and go cadmium. I say this not (only) because it's superior, but because you have started this with such an eye wateringly high standard of detail and finish. Now, i can't really explain this, because it's something you kind of have to see side by side. A British bike of this period with cadmium fittings looks very different to the same bike sporting zinc plated fittings. It's hard to explain, but if you can imagine an old brass screw head that's tens of years old, and has been worn and polished through years and years of contact, it becomes a thing of beauty. Compare it then to a brass screw bought from Home Depot yesterday. Both are essentially the same thing, both have the same metal at their core, yet one is utilitarian, while the other has a tactile "rightness" about it.
When you see the same bikes with zinc and cadmium, both are shiney and new, but deep down inside, you know that one has a look of expediency to it, whereas the other has a look of authenticity to it.
This bikes deserves (ok, demands) that you go the cadmium route. You're not in a race with anyone but yourself. Take the time to stay true to the standards that you have set. When I said your bike was on the way to being one of the best Goldies in the world, I meant it. It's you who has plotted the course. Don't let the nerves get the better of you. You're seeing what looks like a little zinc shortcut here, but you need set it aside, accept that the prep work has driven you nuts, and stay on the track that will reward you for your commitment.......and it genuinely isn't going to be found in zinc! You have said that this bike will never be for sale........so there's neither the need nor the rush to cut corners to maximize profit. As you've found, the devil resides in the detail, and doing the prep work has been that little dance with the devil. You just need to remember that in the finished bike, God resides in the detail too, and something as simple as cadmium plating your fittings is the kind of detail that will make all the difference in the world.....you'll know it when you've assembled it, believe me.
Re: 1962 BSA DBD34 Gold Star restoration (making progress)
i think they have outlawed cad in some parts of the world possibly for the general public and aviation is still exempt? .....the reason i say this is i service a lot of vintage brit bikes so i need to buy parts / hardware often and i hardly see any cad plated parts from england anymore....
.........joe@vcycle
i think they have outlawed cad in some parts of the world possibly for the general public and aviation is still exempt? .....the reason i say this is i service a lot of vintage brit bikes so i need to buy parts / hardware often and i hardly see any cad plated parts from england anymore....
.........joe@vcycle
Re: 1962 BSA DBD34 Gold Star restoration (making progress)
"It's hard to explain, but if you can imagine an old brass screw head that's tens of years old, and has been worn and polished through years and years of contact, it becomes a thing of beauty. Compare it then to a brass screw bought from Home Depot yesterday. Both are essentially the same thing, both have the same metal at their core, yet one is utilitarian, while the other has a tactile "rightness" about it.
When you see the same bikes with zinc and cadmium, both are shiney and new, but deep down inside, you know that one has a look of expediency to it, whereas the other has a look of authenticity to it."
I get it. I use the term "burnish" to describe it. There is something about old metal that has been brought to a polish through wear and long use. Old brass handles, old copper and yes, cadmium plated hardware. I am going with cadmium plating and will send everything to Aero Plating in Colorado; in a moment of weakness I contemplated zinc as a shortcut. Cad just looks right and will last longer than zinc. I just need to carve out the time to blast, wire wheel, photograph and take notes for the rest of my hardware. As with my Triton build, patience is key and I learned to walk away when necessary.
Thanks all.
PS "One of the best Goldies in the world" ? I do not think so, but it will make for an incredible daily rider.
"It's hard to explain, but if you can imagine an old brass screw head that's tens of years old, and has been worn and polished through years and years of contact, it becomes a thing of beauty. Compare it then to a brass screw bought from Home Depot yesterday. Both are essentially the same thing, both have the same metal at their core, yet one is utilitarian, while the other has a tactile "rightness" about it.
When you see the same bikes with zinc and cadmium, both are shiney and new, but deep down inside, you know that one has a look of expediency to it, whereas the other has a look of authenticity to it."
I get it. I use the term "burnish" to describe it. There is something about old metal that has been brought to a polish through wear and long use. Old brass handles, old copper and yes, cadmium plated hardware. I am going with cadmium plating and will send everything to Aero Plating in Colorado; in a moment of weakness I contemplated zinc as a shortcut. Cad just looks right and will last longer than zinc. I just need to carve out the time to blast, wire wheel, photograph and take notes for the rest of my hardware. As with my Triton build, patience is key and I learned to walk away when necessary.
Thanks all.
PS "One of the best Goldies in the world" ? I do not think so, but it will make for an incredible daily rider.
Re: 1962 BSA DBD34 Gold Star restoration (making progress)
Your standard of work up to now has been exemplary......far better than 99% of the work out there. I've seen just about everything that the museum and concours d'elegance scenes in the uk has to offer, and believe me, your bike is on track to be right up there on the upper branches of that tree.
Daily rider? If that's how she ends up, then no complaints from me! Just don't be surprised if having stayed the course, you find yourself with a bike that has you smitten to the point where when it all comes together, you just want to freeze it in time, and keep her for very special occasions.
Glad you're going for cadmium..............it's worth the hassle.
Your standard of work up to now has been exemplary......far better than 99% of the work out there. I've seen just about everything that the museum and concours d'elegance scenes in the uk has to offer, and believe me, your bike is on track to be right up there on the upper branches of that tree.
Daily rider? If that's how she ends up, then no complaints from me! Just don't be surprised if having stayed the course, you find yourself with a bike that has you smitten to the point where when it all comes together, you just want to freeze it in time, and keep her for very special occasions.
Glad you're going for cadmium..............it's worth the hassle.
Re: 1962 BSA DBD34 Gold Star restoration (making progress)
Thanks again Bumpthump for the kind words and encouragement. As I have said from the beginning, I am going to ride this bike as much as I can. There are plenty examples of museum, concours, trailer and living room queen BSA Gold Stars that are never ridden. For me the joy of discovery, the journey of restoration and the self-satisfaction and pride of owning and riding a true classic is what this is all about.
I have (had) a line on a Smiths chronometric speedometer that matches mine to the number. A person on Craigslist was wanting to trade it for another correct one for his restoration. He is still making up is mind what to do with it, but I am first in line should he decide to sell. I picked up a restored replacement tachometer a while ago, but have not found the correct speedo (that I could afford). Joel Levine gave me a rough estimate of $400 to restore mine based on some photographs. This morning I decided to open up my speedo and assess its condition.
Before
I used a few drops of PB Blast on the bezel ring and a rubber strap wrench and to my amazement it came off without much effort.
Everything on this bike was dirty, but had little to no rust due its long storage in the dry stable climate of New Mexico. It is dusty, dirty and filled with dead bugs but not as bad as I feared. I'll carefully clean it up and go from there.
Smiths chronometrics are absolutely gorgeous, made like Swiss watches and unlike the later magnetic gauges, have a jerky, mechanical sweep of their needles that looks so cool when they move.
Thanks again Bumpthump for the kind words and encouragement. As I have said from the beginning, I am going to ride this bike as much as I can. There are plenty examples of museum, concours, trailer and living room queen BSA Gold Stars that are never ridden. For me the joy of discovery, the journey of restoration and the self-satisfaction and pride of owning and riding a true classic is what this is all about.
I have (had) a line on a Smiths chronometric speedometer that matches mine to the number. A person on Craigslist was wanting to trade it for another correct one for his restoration. He is still making up is mind what to do with it, but I am first in line should he decide to sell. I picked up a restored replacement tachometer a while ago, but have not found the correct speedo (that I could afford). Joel Levine gave me a rough estimate of $400 to restore mine based on some photographs. This morning I decided to open up my speedo and assess its condition.
I used a few drops of PB Blast on the bezel ring and a rubber strap wrench and to my amazement it came off without much effort.
Everything on this bike was dirty, but had little to no rust due its long storage in the dry stable climate of New Mexico. It is dusty, dirty and filled with dead bugs but not as bad as I feared. I'll carefully clean it up and go from there.
Smiths chronometrics are absolutely gorgeous, made like Swiss watches and unlike the later magnetic gauges, have a jerky, mechanical sweep of their needles that looks so cool when they move.
JustinLonghorn
No Purple Hearts, No Blue Ribbons
Re: 1962 BSA DBD34 Gold Star restoration (making progress)
Your photography of this build is absolutely gorgeous, sir.
I think that Smith can be saved. They are indeed a beautiful piece of machinery.
Your photography of this build is absolutely gorgeous, sir.
I think that Smith can be saved. They are indeed a beautiful piece of machinery.
Re: 1962 BSA DBD34 Gold Star restoration (making progress)
swan reconsider ....i used aero plating in co three or four times and was not pleased with the quality.....parts were not bright and they were stained on more than one occasion plus he lost a few items once...
go to jet plate in pa.
joe
swan reconsider ....i used aero plating in co three or four times and was not pleased with the quality.....parts were not bright and they were stained on more than one occasion plus he lost a few items once...
go to jet plate in pa.
joe
Re: 1962 BSA DBD34 Gold Star restoration (making progress)
Chronometrics are another deep joy! Yours looks in remarkable condition when all things are considered. Three or four years in a damp British garage would certainly cause more deterioration than yours has suffered. Again, I think you have a bit of thinking to do before letting that one go anywhere!
I'm really glad you aren't going to mummify the bike. You're right............probably more than half of the Goldies still out there never ever turn a wheel. I know of one (a 350) that has sat in the (very large) kitchen of a friend's house since the mid 80s. He'd never part with it (he bought it for a pittance), and sees it as a bit of a conversation piece............if the bike could talk, it would be screaming "help me".
I'm going back to look at your chronometric again..............and chuffed to bits that people can still get pleasure from the mechanical imperfection of the way the needle moves across the face of the instrument. It's another bit of detail that enriches the sense of speed and travel. I can remember the oohs and aaaahs when people first experienced the super smooth movement of Japanese speedos. Chronometrics became yesterdays news very quickly. How things have changed...........
Chronometrics are another deep joy! Yours looks in remarkable condition when all things are considered. Three or four years in a damp British garage would certainly cause more deterioration than yours has suffered. Again, I think you have a bit of thinking to do before letting that one go anywhere!
I'm really glad you aren't going to mummify the bike. You're right............probably more than half of the Goldies still out there never ever turn a wheel. I know of one (a 350) that has sat in the (very large) kitchen of a friend's house since the mid 80s. He'd never part with it (he bought it for a pittance), and sees it as a bit of a conversation piece............if the bike could talk, it would be screaming "help me".
I'm going back to look at your chronometric again..............and chuffed to bits that people can still get pleasure from the mechanical imperfection of the way the needle moves across the face of the instrument. It's another bit of detail that enriches the sense of speed and travel. I can remember the oohs and aaaahs when people first experienced the super smooth movement of Japanese speedos. Chronometrics became yesterdays news very quickly. How things have changed...........
Re: 1962 BSA DBD34 Gold Star restoration (making progress)
"Mummify" great term for bikes that are never ridden! Ahhh, the mysteries and joys of chronometrics. I dissembled my speedometer and despite outward appearances it was not too bad. What at first seemed like an ancient device akin to the Antikythera device, it is really a simple and beautiful work of precision machinery. I spent several hours carefully and meticulously dissembling and cleaning mine. I have the correct tools, patience and the ability to stop when I do not understand something and did not try to force anything loose. A clean bench, trays and good lighting and a large magnifier are essential. So far so good, except I broke a tiny screw which holds the leaf springs. Arrrrrgggg. Smiths are metric and I could not find drill bits, taps or fine screw smaller than 1.5 mm so I may have to use a #90 size screw as a replacement. Also I cannot remove the stabilizer wheel to free all beneath it. More PB Blast and patience so I walked away for now.
I am encouraged and believe my speedo can be saved. The number wheels were frozen and I managed to free them with tiny drops of solvent (away from the numbers to prevent them from smearing). Despite the fact my glass was cracked, there was no real rust, just a hardened layer of extremely fine dust over everything.
I also managed 4 hours of bead blasting and wheel grinding on my hardware. Tonight I should be get another 4 hours in. Making progress and am still researching places to cad plate everything.
"Mummify" great term for bikes that are never ridden! Ahhh, the mysteries and joys of chronometrics. I dissembled my speedometer and despite outward appearances it was not too bad. What at first seemed like an ancient device akin to the Antikythera device, it is really a simple and beautiful work of precision machinery. I spent several hours carefully and meticulously dissembling and cleaning mine. I have the correct tools, patience and the ability to stop when I do not understand something and did not try to force anything loose. A clean bench, trays and good lighting and a large magnifier are essential. So far so good, except I broke a tiny screw which holds the leaf springs. Arrrrrgggg. Smiths are metric and I could not find drill bits, taps or fine screw smaller than 1.5 mm so I may have to use a #90 size screw as a replacement. Also I cannot remove the stabilizer wheel to free all beneath it. More PB Blast and patience so I walked away for now.
I am encouraged and believe my speedo can be saved. The number wheels were frozen and I managed to free them with tiny drops of solvent (away from the numbers to prevent them from smearing). Despite the fact my glass was cracked, there was no real rust, just a hardened layer of extremely fine dust over everything.
I also managed 4 hours of bead blasting and wheel grinding on my hardware. Tonight I should be get another 4 hours in. Making progress and am still researching places to cad plate everything.
