Sunday Rides

catseye

Active Member
When I was able, one of the things I most looked forward to each week was the D3T gathering at Sheets, grabbing a coffee, chatting with the early arrivals, putting on the gloves and hopping on the bike for a mysterious trip on local roads that transported me mentally to a focused task that was totally contrary to the physical realm of everyday life. Getting in the groove of late apexing, squeezing on the throttle as exiting and enjoying the 3 dimensional journey to a end goal of breakfast with good people that share a bond no one can understand unless you are there - laughing at the time half the group zoomed by the other half, oblivious to the turn they just missed, recalling the special spot that brought it all together, recounting the idiot that ran the stop sign or the gravel in the roadway......

It is difficult for a group of more than a few to maintain their comfort level during all phases of a ride. Some want to relax and clear their heads, some want to feel the push and rotation effects in corners occasionally, some want to "do an Italian tune-up" on a expanse of straight road, etc. One of the challenges is to keep it spirited for those that want that, relaxing for those that want that and keeping it safe for all. It doesn't have to be something that divides us and spurs resentment.I invite all that come to this thread to share your thoughts, concerns and possible solutions so that there may at least be groundwork set for all to have a good time and not end up in the ER......
 
I like the fact that we get to push it a little bit on our Sunday rides. When I out alone to ride my little area of the world, I tend to push it as well, but with a group, I know that if something should happen, I won't be sprawled out in the woods or in a ditch waiting for someone to find me. That alone gives me more confidence, allows me to take slightly bigger (calculated) risks, and makes me a better rider. Yes, sometimes we exceed the suggested speed limit, but we always do it safely, and never in a densely populated area. That's what makes us different than another NC sportbike riding group which will remain unnamed.
Also, when we go out on a Sunday, we have so many different types of bikes, that we're always forced - by default - to "ride our own rides." There are some bikes that just aren't able to keep the pace, but we never leave anyone behind. If you want to position yourself near the front and really stretch it out, there's a sub-group available for that. If your machine tops out at a whopping 50 miles an hour, there's a little group towards the back for that. If you want to put along on a moped, smoking a cigar and admiring the scenery, that's fine too. Pick up the stragglers, and we'll wait for you at the next stop sign.
 
So, different people go on rides for different reasons. Some like to go fast. Some like to go slow and enjoy the scenery. Some like to have a destination, some just like to go for a ride then stop for a beer. We ride to events, we ride to just ride, we do some shop days and ride to those. Planning and leading rides can be a real bitch. It is a lot of pressure. It would be best if we spread it around some. If for only one type of person does all the rides, we are going to see things like this after a while, because that person will want to do rides the way they like to ride. Adam is really motivated, energetic, and has been a great ride leader. It would be a shame to have him stop doing this because of the complaining about what kind of ride it is. He should still be able to do his rides his own way.

We ALL should ALWAYS ride our own ride too, and set out own pace. That should be clearly stated at the beginning of each ride we do.

IMHO, we need to plan other ride types, to suit the other types of riders. We need to clearly state what kind of ride it is - things like "spirited ride", "relaxed ride", or "destination ride". This is going to require some of us to step up and volunteer! We want everyone to feel welcome and comfortable, right?

That is a great suggestion about breaking up into different groups, John. I already plan to schedule some relaxed rides, largely because Robin is a relatively new rider and needs that kind of pace while she learns. I am sure that there are others out there that want to run "the pace" for other or similar reasons.
 
yeah. I agree that 99% of the issues can be cleared up by learning to "ride your own ride". As a driving instructor, one of the biggest issues we have with drivers on track at all skill levels is keeping them from focusing on the driver in front of them (unless we're trying to teach them something that the car in front is doing correctly) and getting caught up with the "red mist" (which gets more common as the driver's confidence progresses). It can easily pull one out of their skill level and bikes are a lot less forgiving than cars, IMO.. or in my experience...
 
The other issue, is not the bike capabilities or the rider's capabilities, but on the back roads, one tends to have a few other local car driver who just pull out in front of one, or deer in the road or gravel which some truck has dumped on a corner. Based on this, some of tend to be thinking this most of the time, vs on the capabilities of the bike / driver, which then makes one go slower than others might intend, but at the same time, the rider doesn't want to take chances, with elements that tend to be beyond his control. This has kept me away from the drive like a maniac approach, as it then no longer is fun.
 
cafetbird said:
....Adam is really motivated, energetic, and has been a great ride leader. It would be a shame to have him stop doing this because of the complaining about what kind of ride it is. He should still be able to do his rides his own way.....
amen. Adam deserves a lot of credit for what he has done.
 
Very true Guy. I always enjoyed all of the rides. Both those to/at events and those on Sundays. When I got home I would recall the Sunday rides and realized that they were just too fast to be safe given all the things that were out of our control on small country back roads. I am as guilty as anyone of riding too fast on those roads. That's why I stopped going on the Sunday rides long before they stopped happening. It removes the temptation to ride like a nutter. :-[
 
guysd said:
...This has kept me away from the drive like a maniac approach, as it then no longer is fun.
yes, and we don't want that. We may need to split up from the start. If we still want to meet up at the diner at 11:30, some can plan a 70 mile route, others can plan a 50 mile route. All it takes is for some people to step up and do it.

BTW, I hope I'm not stepping on any toes as someone who isn't even riding (it certainly isn't by choice), but I have gotten pretty attached to this group, it is growing, an I would like to be counted on to be a part and to help out wherever I can. I am working toward getting my abilities up for some kind of 2 wheeled participation...
 
Yep, I used to lead a group that had a lot of sport bike and sport touring riders in it. The rides started getting crazy fast thorugh the mountains, and some folks started complaining and dropping out. The group then became this tight clique of folks who rode together all the time, and they liked that. That was good for a while, but then some folks started dropping out, because some got older and wanted to slow down, or started families, or moved away.... the group eventually died. I stopped riding with them because I realized that the speed my bikes were capable of travelling comfortablly was waaay beyond what was safe on public roads. I came around a corner at 90 and there was a tree in the road in front of me once. Once, a car backed out of a driveway in front of me around a turn. Once I hit a patch of sand with my front tire and almost low-sided. I switched to retro / vintage, because it is better to "drive a slow bike fast than a fast bike slow"!

So, it seems important to me that a group has some variety to stay vital. We will lose some members because this isn't their thing. We will gain new ones for other reasons. New people come into our area every day, and we should try to make them feel welcome. The next person you meet may end up being the best friend you ever have.... I met one like that on the forum not too long ago - my future wife, in fact! ;)

It would be cool if we could set up some track days and such for folks too. Cafe and vintage themed track days? John, maybe you could help with something like that!
 
I'm not really involved with the group anymore so my opinion doesn't carry much weight, but I might be speaking for other people that won't speak up. I have been on many Sunday rides on a handful of different bikes. Some fast and some wouldn't get out of their own way with my fat butt on them, but I never once saw a bike left behind for riding slow. We rode the Sunday before last and I was probably on the fastest most modern bike in the group and decided to ride back with Ian who was a less experienced rider. I was the tail of a group of 6 or 7 bikes and at every turn or at the next light/stop sign the group was waiting for us. Nobody has ever said to any rider that I am aware of to speed up or ride faster than you are comfortable riding. The same variables that are on the Sunday ride in a group will be the same ones that you or I will encounter if we were by ourselves i.e. deer, gravel, tractors, 200 bicycles riding in a row and the occasional dog chasing you as you go by. It just seems to me that the ones that want to piss and cry about things are the last ones in line when it comes to planning or putting in the work that goes into a ride. They expect to show up and ride, but not willing to speak up and say something when they have the chance and feel more comfortable hiding behind a computer screen. This was one of my biggest reasons for stepping away from the group was that everyone had an opinion or a complaint, but nobody was willing to take the initiative and plan something they felt might be better. It was easier to go along with it and then bitch about it after. Adam puts so much damn work into planning and mapping rides every week and it is a slap in the face to troll behind a screen and say a ride is dangerous. The only time a ride is dangerous is when someone pushes their limits beyond what they are comfortable with which also makes the entire group vulnerable to their poor or reckless riding.
 
3rd. degree. What are you talking about trolls for? I'm not bitching. I am simply pointing out why I stopped going to the Sunday rides. It was too tempting to ride too fast for the conditions. Simple as that.
I am not afraid to say it to anyone face to face or behind a screen.
 
Well, everyone has a right to express an opinion.... as human beings, we can all flub up on the tactfulness once in a while. Hopefully we can keep this a civil discussion, and make for a better group as a result.

3rd Degree said:
The only time a ride is dangerous is when someone pushes their limits beyond what they are comfortable with which also makes the entire group vulnerable to their poor or reckless riding.

A true statement. Unfortunately, many folks that ride with us are young or new riders, and don't have the skills, knowledge or experience to ride their own ride yet. We need to keep reminding them: 1. Ride your own ride 2. We will wait for you at the turn. Then, we need to allow them to actually do it.
 
Let's reign it in some, keep it positive. I think it would be safe to assume these are general statements, not accusations of anyone in particular.
 
We all need to be responsible for our own actions. If you don’t like to ride slow then start or volunteer to host a “spirited ride”, or vise versa.
Don’t complain because the group is not offering something catering to your liking. We “all” are the group, so just host an event or a ride every once in a while. Not all who like to ride in a spirited manner feel like riding in a spirited manner always. Some spirited riders may want to enjoy the scenery from time to time.

Sometimes I want to take it easy, other times I just want push my limits, but by no means would I try to push someone else’s limit, Not consciously anyways.
I would not want someone else to do the same and push my limits. But it is up to me to chill out if I feel the ride is too dangerous or beyond my abilities or my motorcycles capabilities. So I must find a ride that suits me or better yet, make one available for others. Step up and do some invites. If no one shows, it should still be a great day. You’re on a motorcycle! Be happy about that!

I think the issue is not so much about what type of rides are available for different types of riders, but maybe a lack of knowledge that all are welcome and encouraged to lead their own rides. It will not be considered stepping on anyone’s toes, unless the person leading a ride is told how they should ride at all the rides they organize.
The Sunday morning rides never stopped. They still go on. It just isn’t available to everyone anymore and for obvious reasons.


The point is simple, get out there and host and lead some rides if one isn’t available for you. No one is holding anyone back.
 
xulf13 said:
We all need to be responsible for our own actions. If you don’t like to ride slow then start or volunteer to host a “spirited ride”, or vise versa.
Don’t complain because the group is not offering something catering to your liking. We “all” are the group, so just host an event or a ride every once in a while. Not all who like to ride in a spirited manner feel like riding in a spirited manner always. Some spirited riders may want to enjoy the scenery from time to time.

Right on. That is part of the problem here too. The group rides have to be diverse, and led by many. Adam does a great ride. Some other folks need to step up too. Eventually, he will likely burn out, even if stuff doesn't keep up like this. I've seen it happen many times. It is just as bad to go on all the rides and never lead one as it is to complain after the fact. That is just my opinion - I understand some folks have their reasons for not wanting to lead a ride.

My last year had a bunch of complications personally, so I had to lay out for a while. Fortunately the worst of it is behind me, so I'll raise my hand again like in the past. Hopefully, some others will do the same?

And BTW, I appreciate all of you who are speaking up... Chas, Jeremy, John, Matt talked to me the other day too. When this crap festers it is the worst! We need to be able to man-up and lay it all out.
 
This is a normal cycle for groups. I've belonged to several groups over the years and it all runs the same cycle. Some think others are riding too fast, others too slow and some bitch about everything. I somehow always was charged with taking the lead and planning rides/trips, and it always got old fairly fast with people approaching me with "some of us would like to enjoy the scenery" and others "what is this, a funeral procession?". You are never going to make everybody happy. Bottom line is, everybody needs to ride their ride. Give a destination, ride with those of "similar ability".

Cycle is, start riding with some buds, their friends, spouse's, and relatives start showing up, the group at first is very energetic and can't wait for the next ride, as the group developes, you get those differences (cracks) in the group, those that prefer different paths, whether topography, intensity or leisure of the ride. The group splits farther and farther apart, till they form their own groups that may grow, or die from the same differences suffered from the previous group. It's not personal, it's just human nature.

I thought this was unique among riders, but I volunteered at my wife's church, at the end of service, half the people would complain that the thermostat was set to high, and half complained it was too low. I always knew when riding or at church, if I got the same amount of complaints from each side, I was doing a good job.
 
ApriliaBill said:
This is a normal cycle for groups. I've belonged to several groups over the years and it all runs the same cycle.

Yep, and some people get a reputation for leading a great ride, then everyone just wants to latch on to that... then that person gets tired of taking all the crap... goes that way often too. I've been that person, I've seen friends be that person. Personally, I like diversity in ideas for rides, destinations, speeds. The only thing that gets old to me is hours on the "slab". A group needs a few folks that put on a good ride for variety!

You are right Bill that some of this is more of a group thing than a bike thing. It is human nature, and it is not unique to riding groups. This is probably the way all groups, clubs, countries, and religions formed in the first place... likely dating back to the cave man.

The one thing I have seen that keeps the flak down on rides is good planning. Tell everyone what the ride is going to be like up front, give them a route, tell them the basic rules, and where the ride will end in case they get separated. Then, no one can complain, because they made the choice to go. But that can get regimented, and take the fun away for some... it ain't "cool".

This is a good old article. A little too practical for some, but gives you some stuff to think about...

http://www.motorcyclistonline.com/flashback/122_0911_the_pace_nick_ienatsch/
 
I have only recently started riding again since a pretty serious accedent some 15 years ago. So I consider myself a very novice rider for all intensive purposes. Ive rode with adam now several times and ill say this. Yeah, adam moves quick, but ive never been left behind, ive never felt pressured to go faster than I was comfertable with, and the one time I felt like I was holding them up because im not as fast on sharp turns, the whole group said it was fine and they didnt feel I was slowing them down, that it was more important for me to feel comferible than to keep pace. The whole group has given me great pointers and I honestly feel I would not have learned this quickly on my own. Maybe his group isnt for everyone, but I really enjoy hanging out with them, and I feel its the right group for me.
 
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