Help, stupid mistake alert!

Sderbyshire

Sderbyshire

Into Sailing, classic Triumph cars and motorbikes.
Seems I've made a stupid mistake / schoolboy error with my 360 rebuild.....

Replaced the wheel bearings front and rear and the bike is all back together and passes it's mot.

Looking at the rear wheel there seem to be some aluminium filings so I check more closely and the rear axle is floating about with a couple of my of lateral movement in the left side bearing. Filings are from the bearing carrier.

Wheel off and check, right bearing is a nice fit but left is 20mm ID, when the axle is 17......

First I blame the supplier of the new bearings..... Then I find the spec is 20mm ID and there should be a spacer thingy...... Which I'm guessing I threw out last week with the old bearings

So.... Does anyone have a source for these spacers?

Alternatively I could probably source a bearing that would fit, and rebuild the hub again??

Can't believe I cleared out all the 'old redundant stuff' and threw out something I needed!!

Help gratefully received

Steve
 
Hope this helps.......http://www.cmsnl.com/honda-cb360-sport-1974-usa_model1007/partslist/F++11.html#results
 
Thanks for that, they list the part but it's not available.

Lots of used stuff available from the us, but the postage might be an issue!

Anybody know of a source for this sort of thing in the uk/Europe?

Thanks

Steve
 
I was reading a post last week where some one left out the spacer in the hub that holds the bearings apart when all is sandwiched tight. Someone recommended it was ok because the shoulder of the recess the bearing was in would hold the bearings in place. WTF, without the sleeve when you tighten the axle it will put side load on the bearings and cause rapid premature failure or the issue you ran into. I have to have a couple made because one of the wheels I bought had a sleeve that has a seam down the middle inside. No way the axle would clear the seam, so I don't know how they made it work before.
 
That spacer is important. You can not fit a bearing with the reduced ID because the correct width of the spacer (and the shoulder it has) is critical to have the stacked assembly of all the components end up being correct. Only then can the whole assembly be compressed into a structural component of the swing arm by tightening the axle nut. Evidently LOTS of people lose this part because they mistake it to be a part of the bearing when as you have discovered it is part of the axle assembly, so you have a lot of company. You'd think somebody would make a replacement since it is such a simple thing. Sorry to be of such zero help - a very simple thing to make if you can find one to copy. o1mark, I have seen these split spacers too, but they worked fine despite seemingly being cheesy - no issues with the axles passing through them though. Seems like a part that should be much more solid though.
 
jpmobius said:
That spacer is important. You can not fit a bearing with the reduced ID because the correct width of the spacer (and the shoulder it has) is critical to have the stacked assembly of all the components end up being correct. Only then can the whole assembly be compressed into a structural component of the swing arm by tightening the axle nut. Evidently LOTS of people lose this part because they mistake it to be a part of the bearing when as you have discovered it is part of the axle assembly, so you have a lot of company. You'd think somebody would make a replacement since it is such a simple thing. Sorry to be of such zero help - a very simple thing to make if you can find one to copy. o1mark, I have seen these split spacers too, but they worked fine despite seemingly being cheesy - no issues with the axles passing through them though. Seems like a part that should be much more solid though.
Click to expand...

pjmobius, Not sure what you mean by "split" spacer. Mine isn't split, just has a ridge down the length of it. The bearings were 20mm, the tube is also 20mm but the ridge sticks up preventing the axle from entering the spacer. The spacer was in the wheel when I bought it. I can't figure out how this set up worked. The tube needs to be the same dimension of the inner bearing race.
 
Thanks for the replies guys.

David silver don't have stock
The spacer I am talking about is not the long tube but the little 'top hat' that fits into the 20mm Id left hand side bearing to make it 17mm.

I agree that I can't just source a 17mm id bearing as it won't be the right width.

I've enquired of a few breakers in the us to see if one will dismantle and post.

It would be easy to turn one up on a lathe if I had the measurements, and a lathe!

This is very frustrating as the bike is immobilised by a simple spacer!

Does anyone have a hub/wheel to sell.....?

Steve
 
Might be worth trying Parts finder.... http://partfinderuk.co.uk/
The postage costs for a used one from the US shouldn't be too much.
 
Thanks guys.

I'm liaising with a couple of breakers in the us to have one removed and shipped.

Steve
 
If you draw a blank in the US. DK Spares in Stoke have a few CB360 spindles on ebay. The part you need isn't included, but might be worth another phone call. http://www.dkmotorcycles.com/
 
Thanks again Semmins, don't know your actual name!

They have a whole wheel for sale for about £100, but wouldn't disassemble it for me.

If I can't get a result from the us, and it looks positive at the moment, then I'll try to negotiate that down a bit.

Steve
 
Sderbyshire said:
Thanks again Semmins, don't know your actual name!

They have a whole wheel for sale for about £100, but wouldn't disassemble it for me.

If I can't get a result from the us, and it looks positive at the moment, then I'll try to negotiate that down a bit.

Steve
Click to expand...


Good luck, my name's Steve btw.
 
o1marc said:
pjmobius, Not sure what you mean by "split" spacer. Mine isn't split, just has a ridge down the length of it. The bearings were 20mm, the tube is also 20mm but the ridge sticks up preventing the axle from entering the spacer. The spacer was in the wheel when I bought it. I can't figure out how this set up worked. The tube needs to be the same dimension of the inner bearing race.
Click to expand...

Looks like a plain jane ERW tube to me. Baffled by your situation - I mean, it came apart but can't go back together? Not what I was referring to as a split tube - I have seen bearing spacers that were literally just a rolled piece of sheet not welded at the joint. I realize that it just spaces the bearings the correct distance apart (the hub does NOT perform this task on ANY common bike application that I know of) but it is very important that the spacer is of solid construction as it does a lot more structurally than merely space the bearings properly. Can't recall where I saw this - it just sticks in my mind because it seemed ridiculously wimpy to me at the time.

Sheesh - I hope someone with a 360 will pop of their rear wheel and measure this part. You could certainly estimate the thing by measuring the parts on hand, but copying the original is the foolproof path.
 
jpmobius said:
Looks like a plain jane ERW tube to me. Baffled by your situation - I mean, it came apart but can't go back together? Not what I was referring to as a split tube - I have seen bearing spacers that were literally just a rolled piece of sheet not welded at the joint. I realize that it just spaces the bearings the correct distance apart (the hub does NOT perform this task on ANY common bike application that I know of) but it is very important that the spacer is of solid construction as it does a lot more structurally than merely space the bearings properly. Can't recall where I saw this - it just sticks in my mind because it seemed ridiculously wimpy to me at the time.

Sheesh - I hope someone with a 360 will pop of their rear wheel and measure this part. You could certainly estimate the thing by measuring the parts on hand, but copying the original is the foolproof path.
Click to expand...
How could this have worked if the axle is 20mm and the bearings are 20mm, but the axle won't enter the hole due to the ridge? The sleeve is a spacer and needs to be the exact length, too short and it will cause rapid bearing failure.
 
Marc, Did that wheel have an axle in it when you bought it? If not, perhaps that why it was available for sale.

I bought a GT750 not too long ago that had one of the internal spacers fitted between the wheel and swing arm and no internal replacement. The balls all fell out and the races were also trashed. The wheel was about a mile from falling apart on the hapless owner.
 
So... Have sourced the 'top hat" spacer for a breaker in the us.

Had to pay him to disassemble a wheel and post it over to me, but cheaper than postage for the whole wheel!

Stripped the bearings out of my wheel earlier, had to destroy the 'ring with four holes' to get to out as had locktited it in .....

So that's parts from the us, new set of bearings, new bearing retainer......

And the moral of the story is, don't throw stuff out until you're certain you don't need it!

Will post update when parts arrive and the little Honda lives again

Steve
 
teazer said:
Marc, Did that wheel have an axle in it when you bought it? If not, perhaps that why it was available for sale.

I bought a GT750 not too long ago that had one of the internal spacers fitted between the wheel and swing arm and no internal replacement. The balls all fell out and the races were also trashed. The wheel was about a mile from falling apart on the hapless owner.
Click to expand...

No axle in it when I bought it. they must have just thrown a sleeve in it to sell. I have to find a way to machine or file that ridge off to get it to work, or just make new ones out of alloy like I probably will do.
 
o1marc said:
No axle in it when I bought it. they must have just thrown a sleeve in it to sell. I have to find a way to machine or file that ridge off to get it to work, or just make new ones out of alloy like I probably will do.
Click to expand...

The guy in the us who just stripped out the 'top hat' for me would probably send you the other spacer, he must have it in his hands.

Would you like his details ??
 
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