CB360 - working on it on the weekends

Re: Work to be done on a CB360

Always pays to "read the Instructions"..

The ballistic website has this info:

Maximum Voltage: 14.4 volts
Minimum Charged Voltage: 13.2 volts
Charged Resting Voltage: 13.2 volts – 13.7 volts.
Minimum Voltage: 9 volts
Standard Charge Rate Specifications: 2amps @ 13.2 volts until the battery reaches a maximum voltage of 14.4 volts

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It also says this:

Warnings:

Do not charge a Ballistic Performance Component Battery above 14.4 Volts. This will damage the battery. Resting voltage of a charged EVO2 battery should be between 13.2v – 13.7v.
Do not charge with an automatic charger in “desulfication” mode.
Do not allow the battery to be drained below 9.0V, this will damage the cells. If your powersports vehicle has a parasitic draw like an alarm of similar devices, disconnect the battery when not in use. If the battery is allowed to be drained below 9.0V, it may not recharge to its maximum capacity. If the battery does become discharged, recharge immediately.
Do not attempt to charge a Ballistic Performance Component Battery that is below 6.0Volts. A Lithium battery below 6.0Volts is considered dead.
Failure to adhere to these charging specifications or exceeding these limits may cause battery failure and will void any potential warranty claim.

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And this:

Charging:

The best method for charging your EVO2 battery is to use the Ballistic Professional Intelligent Digital Balance Charger. It has a fast charge mode, a storage mode, and the ability to charge each cell or series individually. This Balance mode, when used periodically will greatly extend the life of the EVO2 battery.

You can use a conventional automotive or motorcycle based charger to recharge or maintain your EVO2 Battery. When using a conventional charger/trickle charge please check the following:

The charger should have an automatic cut-off at 14.4V to prevent over charging.
If you are using an automatic charger, be sure it does not have an automatic “desulfication” mode. This is a lead-acid specific function that can damage the EVO2 cells.
Some conventional automatic chargers have charging parameters based around lead-acid voltage specifications which are lower than EVO2 voltage specifications. If your automatic charger shuts off at 12.8 volts then it will never fully charge a EVO2 battery with a resting voltage of 13.2v

Maximum Charge Rate for Standard Automotive or Motorcycle based Charger:

EVO2 50 (100-009) – 5A @ 13.2-14.4V until the battery registers 14.4V.
4 Cell EVO 2 (100-010) – 10A @ 13.2-14.4V for until the battery registers 14.4V.
8 Cell EVO 2 (100-011) – 20A @ 13.2-14.4V for until the battery registers 14.4V.
12 Cell EVO 2 (100-012) – 20A @ 13.2-14.4V for until the battery registers 14.4V.
16 Cell EVO 2 (100-013) – 20A @ 13.2-14.4V for until the battery registers 14.4V.

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I know these batteries are light, and powerful, but I know exactly how to make my conventional Lead Acid and AGM batteries last. My present CB750 has the same Yuasa AGM battery I bought for it in June 2006. It still has a 12.6 V resting voltage and has no cranking or other issues. It was $85 at the time.

I like the idea of the Ballistic Battery and the others, but I seem to read about a lot of problems with them. My CB360 has a $37 dollar battery. Even if I have problems, they are $37 problems. I can buy 4 or 5 lead acid batteries for the price of one ballistic.

Good luck with the new battery (no sarcasm intended). They have some nice features, but are a little finicky for my tastes.

Re: Work to be done on a CB360

Thanks for the advice, it really does pay to read the fine print (which I rarely do : )

I was going towards a cheaper battery as well, but turns out the PO upgraded the stator and charging system so I'm more or less stuck with using a more powerful battery, or so I understand it. Still working on painting my tail but if I'm not too tired I'll get on some wiring checking, or do it tomorrow morning, hook up the battery and hopefully she should start up

Work to be done on a CB360

If the regulator was upgraded, you really can choose the battery that fits your needs. The battery is a storage device so you can start your vehicle, a buffer and voltage reference for the regulator. The old lead acid or even AGM type battery, in this respect, work fine. The Li batteries are lighter for their capacity and smaller. Since my build is going for a stock configuration, the standard size battery works fine. I am not worried about drag strip times either so weight is not a serious issue either. The money I don't spend on the battery will go to some other parts I need


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Re: Work to be done on a CB360

So I had an interesting day today...

My tail section is still curing, so I took the multimeter and battery(s) out to see if I could start the bike up. I checked the voltage of the old battery and it read around 13.6, so I decided to throw it in to see if it would start it. Unlike before, the lights (headlight, neutral light) came on, but when I hit the starter, it wouldn't turn the starter over and there was a weird ticking noise. The magnetic starter was vibrating and ticking, and when I hit the starter the wires connected to it would shake a little. I peeled away some of the electric tape in the area, and I don't know what happened but all of a sudden the positive battery wire caught on fire and melted, leaving a ton of smoke. Pretty scary, but after a few minutes I just disconnected the battery; also drained the gas from the tank in the process. The positive wire's burnt and in pieces, I was planning to redo the wiring anyways but I guess this forces me to do it. Still not sure what happened, I'm planning to take it to the shop and have my mechanic take a look, but the wiring's an absolute mess to start with.

The PO said he upgraded the stator and it looks like he got something similar to this as well.

http://www.dimecitycycles.com/vintage-cafe-racer-caferacer-bobber-brat-chopper-custom-motorcycle-electronic-parts-ricks-electric-regulator-rectifier-cb160-cb175-cl175-cb200-cl200-cb350-cl350-cl-450-cb450-cb500t-10-135h.html

Pictures:








:'( :'( :'(

Re: Work to be done on a CB360

That sucks...shouldnt be difficult to find the short now.

Not much to report, still haven't been able to dive into the wiring, but I am home for the weekend so I'm trying to finish up the seat. Did a flat black, then ignored logic and went with a satin clearcoat. Wasn't really looking for a flat black or gloss going into it, but I'm okay with how it's looking. Kind of runny/wet at the top, but it's not a show queen. Picked up way more vinyl then I need today for when the seat's cured, probably be able to work on it next weekend :-\

Got the bike over to the shop today, started disconnecting wires and taking pictures of where everything is right now. Plan is to completely redo the harness, just for peace of mind and to make sure there are no other problems down the road. Will hopefully be doing some more work tomorrow morning.



On the plus side, the battery box I mocked up looks like it'll fit everything, with the starter solenoid going in the space in the corner. Cut out sheet metal, bend and weld the edges together. Also my mechanic says he knows a good painter that doesn't charge that much so I might forgo rattle canning the tank and have him do the tail/tank together, so it'll be well done, more resilient, and not stain from gas hopefully.

Rectifier and regulator need some airflow to keep cool.
Bolting rectifier to box should provide a heatsink.
body of regulator needs to be insulated from ground (it's rubber mounted to stop it touching stuff)

clean up any connections your gonna keep as best you can and use a dap of dielectric grease on each.

crazypj said:

Rectifier and regulator need some airflow to keep cool.

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+1 on that idea. Maybe mount the regulator to the outside of the box, and run the wires into the box. Then the rectifier will have more room around it to "breathe."

It looks like you are running 2 regulators....Is the black one with 5 wires both a regulator and rectifier?...It is large for a rectifier only.

mydlyfkryzis said:

It looks like you are running 2 regulators....Is the black one with 5 wires both a regulator and rectifier?...It is large for a rectifier only.

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I think so, the wiring's custom though so I'm not sure how the PO ran it.

So...



Started peeling off electric tape, surprise surprise the main harness behind the coils is new, but the wires in the headlight bucket and around the coils/ignition are all factory.



Replaced and redid some connections up there, I think I messed up the connections for the blinkers and headlight but we'll see. Rewrapped the rear and redid a few connections there as well, planning to route it under the frame and hook it on with a metal zip tie thing (don't know what it's called

The best part though...cut out a battery box from sheet metal and it turned out pretty well!



Old battery fits snug (new one is the same model) on the sides, planning to put foam on the long sides inside to dampen some vibration. Still thinking about how to mount it to the bike, mechanic's idea was to make a triangle shape with metal, bolt it to the fender then it would act as a table for the battery box. The room for the foam is also so I can drill holes for the regulator and starter, fuse box is going to be routed under the seat cowl for easy access. Also replaced the main fuse, was looking a little ragged.

If the 'finned' rectifier has 3 yellow, one red, one green, one black wire, I would use that and remove the original regulator
The black wire is 'signal voltage' you may need to bridge a few connectors or build a real custom harness (actually easier than modifying stock harness)

Should only have 2 yellows for a CB360....we have a single phase alternator.

Of course, the PO may have used the wrong one too...

I wire the yellow, pink and white to the three yellow inputs, doesn't harm anything even if there is no improvement.
Guess the lower output from yellow wire will give rectifier an easier time? (I just don't like having loose wires hanging about )

I stayed with stock wiring, so my white and yellow are still connected under the fuel tank as stock, and there is only the yellow, pink, red/white, and green at the reg/rectifier. I cut the old 4 pin rectifier connecter off the original rectifier, and used it for a more stock look. You can see the pics on my build posts. No dangling wires there.


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Well I'm on spring break so more time to work on the bike! ;D ;D ;D

Spent the day at the shop trying to get stuff done, here are my updates. Please excuse any errors, I'm pretty tired

So I took the battery box from last week, traced it against the foam the new battery came in, and popped that into the box. The foam fit pretty well, battery wouldn't move around even with some shaking.



Went to Ace Hardware and got these insulated clamp things, I don't know the proper name for them to use to mount the battery box. After a metal punch and a drill, drilled holes in, made another trip to Ace because I forgot nuts and bolts that would fit, and got some L braces for more support.



The clamps, along with some washers, fit and held the battery box in really snugly. For good measure, I put the L braces in a clamp and hammered them in to make a little table for the box underneath, mounted to the fender. Cut and glued bits of an old tube to the metal so the box wouldn't be hitting bare metal.



I know it's not as good as some of the other stuff people here make, but it was more or less fully made by me, it's pretty clean, and I'm super stoked on it 8)

For the rest of the wiring, I used bolts into the fender again to secure the regulator/rectifier, starter, and regulator. I think the factor regulator is hooked up to the lights, and it's not too big of a problem, so for now I'm going to leave both the RR and regulator wired. Don't judge me, but I really want to get it running so I can have some fun with it over break. I don't think this is half-assing it too much, I'll be working on it more in the future as well.



This part isn't as clean as the battery box, sort of misaligned, but tomorrow hopefully I'll move some things around and get the wiring harness in place.



Bonus surprise for me: my mechanic took my seat and tank to the painter while I was taking my finals at school, and I found them all nice in the other room today!



Flat black, nothing fancy, but I like it, it should look pretty cool with the raw metal of the frame and the somewhat ratty look overall. No gloss here! Plus the painter only charged $50, which is pretty damn cheap for the quality he does.

Extra story: a girl at the shop had her GSXR600 fairings done by the same painter, but I guess it's her first bike and she's still learning. She's pretty short too, and ended up dropping the bike Some scratches on the right fairing, but it could have been worse.

Heading back to the shop in the morning, let's see how far I can get tomorrow!

Looking good. I really like the flat paint also.
oh, and the proper name for the one hole insulated pipe straps is "One hole insulated clamp things"

I've been going to the shop more and more, getting hands on with it as opposed to when I could only work on my bike on the weekends and I would think about/obsess over it in class. So, progress update:

Tentatively finished wiring, headlight comes on, tail light/blinkers aren't working the way they should but I'm not worrying about that right now. Hit the starter and it turned over the motor, so I connected the gas tank and seat and wheeled it outside to take it for a ride. Uh oh, battery voltage is dropping and starter solenoid is ticking and not turning over the starter. Wheel it back it, unbolt the seat, and mess around with it. Sort of hard to explain my wiring situation since I don't even fully understand it but here goes: I have a negative line that goes to the battery and the regulator rectifier, and a positive line that goes to a bolt connecting three wires: the positive battery, one to the regulator/rectifier, and another to the starter magnet. (that's how it was before all the problems). Tried removing the R/R wire and taking the starter solenoid wire straight to the battery, nothing happening, same ticking. Voltage on the Ballistic was fine until I hit the starter, then it would drop to around 7.5volts and in one instance fried the positive battery line again. After some troubleshooting and worrying, I looked at the wire from the starter motor itself under the bike, and the insulation had dryrotted/been cut, it was close to the chain so it looks like wheeling the bike/riding around had exposed the wires and was grounding it. Hmm... Tried moving the wire away from the chain, but it's still in bad condition. Wouldn't turn the motor over, but I have a spare starter motor wire from the old motor I'll be hooking up tomorrow hoping for a better result.

Also, forgot, but on Saturday I couldn't resist and I mounted the tank/tail just to see what the bike would look like. Shot is out of focus, lighting is bad, and seat needs to be upholstered, but better shots will be taken when the bike is more or less complete 8)

Do you have the starter switch wired so that it cuts out the lighting circuit when you have it pressed for starting circuit? In other words, does your lighting system remain "high" while trying to turn starter?

I wired mine this past weekend. So it cuts out the entire lighting system when the starter button is pressed. That way shes not wasting "1.21 gigawatts" to the lights at the same time shes cranking the starter. All battery juice is dedicated to the coils and starter motor.

If I remember correctly the original stock Honda system would only cut out the headlight when starter circuit was engaged leaving the tail and running lights on.

Also, what is the wire running from under the tank down past headers towards starter in this pic? If thats the wire to your starter. its too small and will fry.