new tires just came in... think i messed up
- Thread starter XsjadoTwin
- Start date
mydlyfkryzis
当有疑问时踢你的敌人在生殖器上，你可以道歉后
bubonicplay said:
you really didn't address the post. Bigger tires are O.K. The thing is, the rim should be the right size for the tire.
the rims have a range of sizes that work. they are in the gray boxes. If you are outside the gray boxes, then you are being stupid. A wider tire with a wider rim, will handle slower, but will not lose lateral stability, which can cause loss of traction. You don't have to be racing. Hit a sandy curve, have a cage cut you off, those kind of event where you need everything you can get.
FWIW, lot's of people do stupid things. You want to be one, that's O.K. with me. I did my share of stupid things when I was young. I got wiser as I got older.
You have experienced people explaining it, you have formal charts showing you the correct way. You can do want you want, but are fully informed.
You remind me of this guy who was told too much negative camber is bad. He did it his way too...
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mydlyfkryzis
当有疑问时踢你的敌人在生殖器上，你可以道歉后
xb33bsa said:
All my foot pegs and kick stand levers are scratched. My 750 has no chicken strips on the front, the rear chicken strips are small, limited by scraping hard parts.
The 360 used to be pushed that hard, but I only scrape the kick stand lever occasionally....she's too old to play rough with...
I still go stupid on occasion ;D
crazypj
Split personality, I fake being smart
bubonicplay said:
That isn't even close to one size up from stock.
A 100mm tyre is almost 4.00" wide, tyres used to go in 1/4" increments (3.00, 3.25, 3.50, 3.75, 4.00) so your four sizes up from stock, 3.00 on 1.60 rim was marginal in the first place.
Everyone who has fitted 90/90 front and 110/90 rear on 1.85/2.15 has noticed just how much better the handling is.
You won't know or believe it until you actually do the modifications.
The bike IS twitchy with 90/90 f, 110/90 r on stock rims, I can't even imagine how bad it is with a 100/90 or wider tyre on 1.60 rim?
I just hope no-one gets sued for giving dangerous 'advice' :
There were several people who have tried this fat yre nonsense, don't see any of them posting any longer (except the few who took off the clown shoes for something that works ;D )
bubonicplay said:
Actually you have that backwards.
The extra 'crowning' of tyre means you get more tread on the road when leaned over 45 degrees or more and many vintage racers using street tyres (as opposed to $200.00+ each race tyres) will go 10mm 'too big'
If the rules allow, wider rims will be fitted with max width tyre for rim width, it does give more stability so you can ride faster (or slow down less in the turns)
One other advantage going oversize on vintage race bike, there is less tyre drag when upright so your limited power isn't 'wasted' heating up tread
I used to really like Dunlop KR race tyres, but, bike was real scary on a long straight as center was so narrow.
Rarely needed to brake though, just toss it into corner and keep on the gas, the added drag could slow you down 15~20mph
Doesn't really show how angled the tread is but you may get the idea
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dunlop-KR96-Road-Racing-Tire-Vintage-3-00-3-25-x-18-/141128689057
xb33bsa said:
something like this?
Sorry but it's only about 40degrees of lean, I don't like to go too far on roads I've never seen before ;D
XsjadoTwin
Been Around the Block
Alright I have taken all of your great advice and returned the front 100, now question is should I go for a 3.00in or 2.75? I saw someone post that the 90/90 was still iffy on the front.
What size tire will give me THE best overall handling?
What size tire will give me THE best overall handling?
XsjadoTwin
Been Around the Block
ok so took back the Shinko 712's and got some Michelin's (Gazells i think they're called)2.75front 3.50rear
they should be in sometime this week.
they should be in sometime this week.
MXSeatPro.com
New Member
The Avon Road Riders AM26 are legit, but expensive. Shinko's are crap, and dangerous. Michelin's are OK but fairly expensive and lack grip.The new Dunlop Q2/Q3 are the best street tires out right now, but are not for Cafe bikes...But this is just my opinion. Ride all of these and respond with your thoughts.
As for the Tire size to rim tolerance debate: Putting larger tires than suggested by the OE is NOT a good idea. Although it looks cool, you loose contact surface with the road because you have increased the radius of the tire to fit into a smaller wheel. Next time you are standing in front of a tire rack contemplating how big of a tire you can fit on your wheel, pull the desired tire down and squeeze the beads together and watch the radius get sharper. This is what happens when you put it on your wheel. So as cool as it may seem to run that bigger, you're loosing traction, which isn't soo cool.
A 21 speed road bike has the best 2 wheel geometry for speed and handling. Most motorcycle companies base their angles off of this design to improve their bike's ability. Road bike's have very narrow tires not only to reduce weight but also keep the contact patches of the front and rear tires in line for improved handling. This applies to your motorcycle too. Large rear tires and skinny front tires make the front end push. I assume most of you have experienced backing a bike into a turn. Doing so will slow you down, for one, but also change the parabolic angle of the larger rear tire to be the same or greater than the skinnier front tire forcing you into a tighter turn at high speed...
This was quite a ramble but I just want to point out the science behind geometry and tire size that has a huge effect on speed and handling. Be safe and smart in your tire choices.
As for the Tire size to rim tolerance debate: Putting larger tires than suggested by the OE is NOT a good idea. Although it looks cool, you loose contact surface with the road because you have increased the radius of the tire to fit into a smaller wheel. Next time you are standing in front of a tire rack contemplating how big of a tire you can fit on your wheel, pull the desired tire down and squeeze the beads together and watch the radius get sharper. This is what happens when you put it on your wheel. So as cool as it may seem to run that bigger, you're loosing traction, which isn't soo cool.
A 21 speed road bike has the best 2 wheel geometry for speed and handling. Most motorcycle companies base their angles off of this design to improve their bike's ability. Road bike's have very narrow tires not only to reduce weight but also keep the contact patches of the front and rear tires in line for improved handling. This applies to your motorcycle too. Large rear tires and skinny front tires make the front end push. I assume most of you have experienced backing a bike into a turn. Doing so will slow you down, for one, but also change the parabolic angle of the larger rear tire to be the same or greater than the skinnier front tire forcing you into a tighter turn at high speed...
This was quite a ramble but I just want to point out the science behind geometry and tire size that has a huge effect on speed and handling. Be safe and smart in your tire choices.
D4N63R
Been Around the Block
First off your tire pressure is way more important then if you are out 10mm on tire size. you can also account for the added width with pressure changes (at the expense of tire life)
people think bikes with skinnier tires handle better because a skinny tire is easier to turn then a wide tire.
It would be nice if you could keep the size the same on the front (in slicks im limited to 120 sooooo i have nothing to really go off of there) but on the rear dont be afraid to mess around a bit.
the following paragraph is based on similar tire pressure.
a wide tire on a skinny rim will not feel sluggish, it will be twitchy, because the tire is over round, so mad turn in and a smaller contact patch. this is why I run a 5" rear wheel on the sumo on a fast track instead of a 4.25" I run a 160 tire on both, on a tight track i like the 4.25" wheel because the bike will turn in a bit faster, but having the tire in a 5" rim gives me all the grip in the world. The grip difference, same tire, wheel to wheel is noticeable, the difference in turn in is also noticeable. You just have to choose which one your prefer.
At the end of the day everyone here runs a 160 rear tire on a 5" wheel except for one guy. That guy just happens to be the lap record holder (for 5 years now) on a 4.25" BTW recommended tire size for a 4.25 is 140, with a oh god dont go any bigger max of 150. No one makes a slick or DOT tire worth buying in a 150 so everyone went 160 and realized you can just whack the throttle with no adverse affects.... Big rears are a good thing.
Now lets say you put a wider tire on and drop 3psi
now you are like all the 600 guys that go to a 200 rear from the factory 180 (IE everyone does it because they have way more freaking grip a race pressure on corner exit) thats 20mm on the same wheel one spins up on exit (the 180) and one doesn't (the 200)
people telling you you're going to die if you go to a 110 from a 100 are grossly exaggerating. i often change my wheel width by 3/4" and im still alive to talk about it... Now im not telling you to put a 4" wide tire on a 1" wide wheel. Use some sense when thinking it all over... But if you put a 100 on a bike that came with a 90 you're probably not even going to notice the difference...
EDIT: My lady friend that races in our spec 250 class (ninjas and CBRs) has just told me her bike comes with a 110 front from factory and they use a 120 slick.
and since everyone is in here talking about all the parts they grind off when all that says is they have crap body position. I may not grind off parts but I can grind off an elbow slider... (on a 20mm over sized rear no less)
people think bikes with skinnier tires handle better because a skinny tire is easier to turn then a wide tire.
It would be nice if you could keep the size the same on the front (in slicks im limited to 120 sooooo i have nothing to really go off of there) but on the rear dont be afraid to mess around a bit.
the following paragraph is based on similar tire pressure.
a wide tire on a skinny rim will not feel sluggish, it will be twitchy, because the tire is over round, so mad turn in and a smaller contact patch. this is why I run a 5" rear wheel on the sumo on a fast track instead of a 4.25" I run a 160 tire on both, on a tight track i like the 4.25" wheel because the bike will turn in a bit faster, but having the tire in a 5" rim gives me all the grip in the world. The grip difference, same tire, wheel to wheel is noticeable, the difference in turn in is also noticeable. You just have to choose which one your prefer.
At the end of the day everyone here runs a 160 rear tire on a 5" wheel except for one guy. That guy just happens to be the lap record holder (for 5 years now) on a 4.25" BTW recommended tire size for a 4.25 is 140, with a oh god dont go any bigger max of 150. No one makes a slick or DOT tire worth buying in a 150 so everyone went 160 and realized you can just whack the throttle with no adverse affects.... Big rears are a good thing.
Now lets say you put a wider tire on and drop 3psi
now you are like all the 600 guys that go to a 200 rear from the factory 180 (IE everyone does it because they have way more freaking grip a race pressure on corner exit) thats 20mm on the same wheel one spins up on exit (the 180) and one doesn't (the 200)
people telling you you're going to die if you go to a 110 from a 100 are grossly exaggerating. i often change my wheel width by 3/4" and im still alive to talk about it... Now im not telling you to put a 4" wide tire on a 1" wide wheel. Use some sense when thinking it all over... But if you put a 100 on a bike that came with a 90 you're probably not even going to notice the difference...
EDIT: My lady friend that races in our spec 250 class (ninjas and CBRs) has just told me her bike comes with a 110 front from factory and they use a 120 slick.
and since everyone is in here talking about all the parts they grind off when all that says is they have crap body position. I may not grind off parts but I can grind off an elbow slider... (on a 20mm over sized rear no less)
crazypj
Split personality, I fake being smart
D4N63R, I get the feeling your joining the conversation about 5 yrs after everyone else
The question isn't 'fat' tyre VS 'narrow' tyres but fat tyres on rims way too narrow for them
Go get a pair of GS 500 wheels (3.00 f, 3.50 r) and put 120 front, 180~190 rear on them then tell us all how well it handles, you'll have a load more tread in contact with pavement when your 45+ degrees leaned over
I've already pointed out that there are reasons to use 10+mm wider tyres on 'too narrow' rims, but, it will make bike twitchy running 90/90 front, 110/90 rear on stock 350/360 rims (pretty sure it was in this thread)
A noob on the street doesn't need bike that turns in quick but needs a bike that is ultra predictable.
If you have any real experience you'll know even stock 70's bikes are not the best handling
BTW, your 'gorrilla' riding style may grind elbow sliders but that doesn't cut it for street riding (and just about all modern sport bikes will lean 50 degrees before anything drags on the floor,you pic looks less than 40 deg, no need to get elbow down there, it's just posing)
Stay on the track, try leaning over a bit further and hanging off, then, you may be the next 'fast guy'
Oh, and try a lower powered bike, you will probably learn to go faster when you cant just accelerate but have to be flat out everywhere
The question isn't 'fat' tyre VS 'narrow' tyres but fat tyres on rims way too narrow for them
Go get a pair of GS 500 wheels (3.00 f, 3.50 r) and put 120 front, 180~190 rear on them then tell us all how well it handles, you'll have a load more tread in contact with pavement when your 45+ degrees leaned over
I've already pointed out that there are reasons to use 10+mm wider tyres on 'too narrow' rims, but, it will make bike twitchy running 90/90 front, 110/90 rear on stock 350/360 rims (pretty sure it was in this thread)
A noob on the street doesn't need bike that turns in quick but needs a bike that is ultra predictable.
If you have any real experience you'll know even stock 70's bikes are not the best handling
BTW, your 'gorrilla' riding style may grind elbow sliders but that doesn't cut it for street riding (and just about all modern sport bikes will lean 50 degrees before anything drags on the floor,you pic looks less than 40 deg, no need to get elbow down there, it's just posing)
Stay on the track, try leaning over a bit further and hanging off, then, you may be the next 'fast guy'
Oh, and try a lower powered bike, you will probably learn to go faster when you cant just accelerate but have to be flat out everywhere
