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Blood Sweat Tears and Grease => Bodywork / Painting / Plating => Topic started by: dewy on Oct 02, 2013, 02:36:03

Title: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: dewy on Oct 02, 2013, 02:36:03
Just doing some research before I destroy the frame on my project CB750. I've seen in a few online videos and the like (Cafe Racer's episode of DCC most notable) that some kind of blow torch was used to detab some bike frames.

I'm going to have a number of tabs and centre stand to remove from my bike. And I'm not wondering if this is the preferred method by these workshops for any reason in particular. I've only got a Grinder available in my own workshop, are there any downsides to using this?
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: DesmoBro on Oct 02, 2013, 03:49:10
Grinder is my favorite tool it will work great, you can cut/sand/smooth with it you can probably do even more with it if you get creative...Just don't cut off the tabs you may want to use again....Example your fingers....always use gloves and no neck ties / unzipped sweaters/shit that dangles while using the Grinder
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: dewy on Oct 02, 2013, 04:17:26
Example your fingers
Probably a good idea.

no neck ties [...] while using the Grinder
Well so much for living tweed and riding dapper...

But in all seriousness I appreciate the reply and I am gradually developing a skill with the grinder while converting my fear of the grinder into a respect of one. Eye and Hand Protection are always important, I've grown to prefer my cordless grinder as it's one less hazard (no cord).
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: cinqmars2 on Oct 02, 2013, 06:24:57
You'll actually find contrasting theories about hand protection, although gloves will stop shards of metal from sinking into your skin, they do pose a threat of getting dragged in to the grinder, always use well-fitting gloves with nothing loose on them.

In terms of cutting tabs, the best way I've found is to find a thin cutting disc, 1mm will be sufficient:

http://www.weldequip.com/products/1mm-cutting-disc-115mm-large.jpg


Then use a flap wheel disc to smooth it out, they take a while to get through metal so you've got loads of room to get it smooth.

http://www.toolspot.co.uk/i/4162z.jpg


I find a grinding disc can leave an uneven finish as it just chews through everything it touches, but it all depends on how sober you are when you're using it though I guess.


That blowtorch you mentioned, I haven't seen the show but I'm presuming it would be a plasma cutter.

Good luck slicing your frame  ;)
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: dewy on Oct 02, 2013, 09:00:16
You'll actually find contrasting theories about hand protection, although gloves will stop shards of metal from sinking into your skin, they do pose a threat of getting dragged in to the grinder, always use well-fitting gloves with nothing loose on them.

In terms of cutting tabs, the best way I've found is to find a thin cutting disc, 1mm will be sufficient:

http://www.weldequip.com/products/1mm-cutting-disc-115mm-large.jpg


Then use a flap wheel disc to smooth it out, they take a while to get through metal so you've got loads of room to get it smooth.

http://www.toolspot.co.uk/i/4162z.jpg


I find a grinding disc can leave an uneven finish as it just chews through everything it touches, but it all depends on how sober you are when you're using it though I guess.


That blowtorch you mentioned, I haven't seen the show but I'm presuming it would be a plasma cutter.

Good luck slicing your frame  ;)

Pretty much the way I was looking at doing it, just starting to search around for a cheaper way of purchasing the flap discs as they are around $15-20 each for a 110/115mm size one at local hardware stores :O
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: cinqmars2 on Oct 02, 2013, 09:11:09
Yeah they aint cheap but they last longer than you'd think.
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: mark13018 on Oct 02, 2013, 09:18:04
as stated above. Safety first... Tools of choice: grinder with thin cutting disk to remove the large part of the tab making sure to preserve the tube portion of the frame then sanding disc or flap wheel. I'd does last for awhile AND do take it slow. Just because its technically a "sanding" disc, it will still chew that tube frame pretty easily... Wouldn't want to bust out the welder because you took off to much metal. ;)
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: ILoveThumpers on Oct 02, 2013, 09:31:24
Flap wheels may be the greatest invention ever. I discovered them while working on a stainless steel part at work and couldn't keep it from blueing when it got hot. The answer was the flap wheel... fantastic control, reduced heat, great finish.

-Deek
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: hillsy on Oct 02, 2013, 10:50:02
Gloves getting dragged into an angle grinder? Must be pretty thin (IE: shitty) gloves.


I use welding gloves when I grind - also use a welding helmet to protect my eyes (I wear glasses).


Cutting disc to get the tab off, then flap disc to take the stub down to the frame tube.
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: Slantyface on Oct 02, 2013, 13:39:16
+1 to this thread. I was looking at de-tabbing this winter and was wondering how. Lots of good info, including the flappy sanding disk.
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: SONIC. on Oct 02, 2013, 14:21:01
I swear this site if the safest bunch of guys I've ever seen.
Pair of sunglasses and no gloves for me  8)
I hate grinding in gloves, I have no control in gloves big enough to do any good, and mechanics gloves are useless against a grinder wheel.

Although I did have to get a piece of metal drilled out of my eye once. So theres that.
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: Math750 on Oct 02, 2013, 14:38:20
Pretty much the way I was looking at doing it, just starting to search around for a cheaper way of purchasing the flap discs as they are around $15-20 each for a 110/115mm size one at local hardware stores :O

First time I saw something that is cheaper in Brazil, flap discs here are about $ 3 each for the same size! hahaha
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: Bert Jan on Oct 02, 2013, 17:23:26
Over here in Holland you've got this francise store called 'Action'. They've got 10packs of cuttingdisks for 2,99 euro and a 5 pack of sanding disks for 2,49
Hey, they may not last as long as the 15$ ones, but for 15$ i can buy 30 of them hehe

As i cut, de-tab and weld on a daily basis, i figured i best buy the cheapest ones as i use them so much.
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: hillsy on Oct 03, 2013, 00:36:09

Although I did have to get a piece of metal drilled out of my eye once. So theres that.


Yep. Welding gloves and helmet work pretty good.
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: o1marc on Oct 03, 2013, 12:52:53
Sawzall and a grinder.
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: SONIC. on Oct 03, 2013, 14:13:21
Sawzall and a grinder.
I'm with mark.
I use the sawzall first, then a grinder on the ones the saw won't reach, then the flap wheel.
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: Scruffy on Oct 04, 2013, 20:57:21
Cold chisel and a file, pay the Mennonite/Amish kid down the road to deal with it. What, he works cheap...

Kidding, angle grinder with cut off wheel followed by a flap wheel. And since I solid weld all the seams tight on old frames anyway, don't worry too much about perfection right off the bat. The added welds will still need to metal molded/dressed, etc.

We DO have some Mennonites nearby, but they all run dairies, bakeries and organic farms. With fairly modern equipment.
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: mark13018 on Oct 04, 2013, 22:39:43
I'm with mark.
I use the sawzall first, then a grinder on the ones the saw won't reach, then the flap wheel.

I actually have used the recip saw a few times as well... Something about the spraying embers with the grinder while I'm cutting is just visually and mentally appealing.  :)
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: dewy on Oct 05, 2013, 10:40:12

Yep. Welding gloves and helmet work pretty good.

This - motorcycle Helmets are great, but worth far too much to put in the line of duty.

I'd like the thank everyone for their input, if I can manage I may do a little practise and attempt to put together a film on how to do this.

And since I solid weld all the seams tight on old frames anyway, don't worry too much about perfection right off the bat. The added welds will still need to metal molded/dressed, etc.

Are you refering to existing welds in the frame - you redo/add to them or some such?
Title: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: Rich Ard on Oct 05, 2013, 12:10:36

...I may do a little practise and attempt to put together a film on how to do this.


A video of how to cut tabs off of things? Sounds fascinating.
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: Joon-yah on Oct 05, 2013, 12:22:08
A video of how to cut tabs off of things? Sounds fascinating.
       You should do it!!
Title: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: Rich Ard on Oct 05, 2013, 12:40:00
Hell I'll watch it
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: J-Rod10 on Oct 05, 2013, 13:56:35
I wear a nice pair of leather batting gloves from my baseball days. They are tight fitting, and do not hamper control.
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: bradj on Oct 06, 2013, 20:44:10
I swear this site if the safest bunch of guys I've ever seen.

this^

 dont forget your tampons mother nature can play hell on those pretty white pants

I get not knowing, but i cant for the life of me understand not tring. Its only metal it can be fixed. man up and risk a mistake in exchange for a lesson
Title: Re: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: Kanticoy on Oct 06, 2013, 22:12:06
this^

 dont forget your tampons mother nature can play hell on those pretty white pants

I get not knowing, but i cant for the life of me understand not tring. Its only metal it can be fixed. man up and risk a mistake in exchange for a lesson

Quote of the year.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 4

Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: Ellwood on Oct 14, 2013, 11:09:47
Do yourself a favor and don't hold any small parts with one hand while grinding cutting with the other.  The blades and high speed wire brushes love to jump and eat things.  Don't ask me how I know ::)  Unless of course you wear break away shirts and have kevlar skin.
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: CrabsAndCylinders on Oct 14, 2013, 14:18:08
While grinding tabs off and wearing my regular glasses, I learned two things:

    1. Wear proper eye protection (save your glasses, $350).

    2. Wear proper eye protection (save your eyes, >$350).

I use ear plugs or muffs all the time too, I have lost some hearing.  I listened to a Minnie Riperton record the other day and I thought it was all instrumental.

Just be careful, you can reweld tabs but when I tried to reattach the tip of one of my favourite fingers it never took and Super Glue refused to stand behind their product.  Just as well, I suppose because I put it on backwards and it would bend in a contrary direction to its siblings.  Damn, I miss that tip, not as much as my girlfriend does but we did have some great adventures together.  Lefty is just not the same although he does try.

Maybe Ichiban could wade into this subject.


       
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: krafty on Nov 18, 2013, 10:32:46
I'm late to the party on this one, but I will chime in with what we use at the shop.

We like to cut with 1/32" 3" discs on a die grinder, not a muffler-cutter - we use 3M 01987 (K113271).  The 1/32" wheel is thinner than you usually find with most grinders but at 1/2 the thickness it cuts much faster.

Once the rough-cut is made we grind the remaining bits most of the way down with the edge of a 1/16" disc - 3M 01988 (K61076). 

After it's ground almost all the way flush we use a 2" 36-grit Roloc disc on an angle grinder to get it smoooooooooth.

Always, always, always wear eye protection.  We just use face shields and earmuffs along with old, dirty TIG gloves to protect your hands from flying debris.
Title: Re: Correct way to de-tab?
Post by: Ichiban Moto on Nov 19, 2013, 14:35:24


Maybe Ichiban could wade into this subject.
       

 ;) luck has it that I posted a vid on this topic here:

http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=52954.msg622520#msg622520