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Blood Sweat Tears and Grease => Projects => Cafe Racers => Topic started by: NJ Cam on Sep 05, 2013, 11:24:49

Title: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: NJ Cam on Sep 05, 2013, 11:24:49
So I have had the bike a week now.

After fixing a leak in the fuel line (what a mess), & changing the oil  I attempted to fire her up with just a battery jump pack.... no success.

All lights work, and I can hear the electric start attempt to fire (tried the kick start as well) but engine doesn't turn.

 So my work begins to clean her up and get her running.

 Below are some pics from her old home....under a tarp in NJ  :-[
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: NJ Cam on Sep 05, 2013, 11:34:25
Last night was the first night I was able to put in some time on her.

Cleaned up some surface rust and pulled a bunch of parts off for cleaning.
Tank is in decent condition and I am in the process of cleaning via the vinegar/BB's Skrews method.

Currently in my shopping cart (based on the problem points I've found thus far)...let me know any "must haves" I am missing
Battery
Fuel Lines
Seal/Gasket Kit
Spark Plugs and Wires
Throttle and Brake Cables
UNI Air Filters
(thinking about the PAMCO ignition)...thoughts?

Some tear down pics from last night
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: Rich Ard on Sep 05, 2013, 11:44:28
I used a PAMCO on my CB450, and I really liked it.

Small consumables, you may find less expensive locally - I buy fuel line and plugs at a shop close to home for far less than they cost through the internet.
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: AlphaDogCustoms on Sep 05, 2013, 12:07:04
Whoa! Whoa! Whoa!
Hold yer fuckin' horses, there cowboy.

Don't start spending money on a bunch of random parts. Get the fuckin' thing running.

Have you got spark? Will it fire when you shoot ether into the intake? Diagnose and fix what is wrong with it FIRST. THEN, if you appear to have a viable engine, THEN think about spending money on parts.

Don't set yourself up with a money pit that will never see the road. Plan your work, work your plan.

Step 1: Get it running with minimal outlay of cash.

You do have a clear title, right?
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: Rich Ard on Sep 05, 2013, 12:09:33
Whoa! Whoa! Whoa!
Hold yer fuckin' horses, there cowboy.

Don't start spending money on a bunch of random parts. Get the fuckin' thing running.

Have you got spark? Will it fire when you shoot ether into the intake? Diagnose and fix what is wrong with it FIRST. THEN, if you appear to have a viable engine, THEN think about spending money on parts.

Don't set yourself up with a money pit that will never see the road. Plan your work, work your plan.

Step 1: Get it running with minimal outlay of cash.

You do have a clear title, right?

^ +1

Sorry, I didn't see your first post in which it sounds at though there's a possibility that the engine is locked up.
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: SONIC. on Sep 05, 2013, 13:07:05
Yeah i was gonna say....
Sounds like a seized engine if you cant turn it with the kicker or the starter.
Thats bad news if you don't know what your doing. It means 99% necessary to do an engine rebuild, if you can even get it un-stuck.
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: NJ Cam on Sep 05, 2013, 14:32:33
Appreciate the comments.

Ill see if I can get spark and go from there.  The wires were pretty torn up and new plugs are never a bad idea. Hence those being on my list.

Do I need a new battery or do you think the jumper will do the trick for the time being?



Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: AlphaDogCustoms on Sep 05, 2013, 14:36:28
You can use a jumper for troubleshooting purposes.
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: dbdotdot on Sep 05, 2013, 21:15:59
Engine doesn't turn. Sigh. Time to buy the manual and break out the breaking apart tools. OR, buy cool clip-ons, ignitions, led lights, and billet bits from Dime City and make roaring sounds from the sofa. I'll take option #2.
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: Rich Ard on Sep 05, 2013, 21:19:47
[sigh]
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: NJ Cam on Sep 05, 2013, 21:22:15
Little update.

No Spark out of the left side. Right lights up.
Flipped the plugs to ensure it wasn't the issue...both plugs light on the right side.

 
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: AlphaDogCustoms on Sep 06, 2013, 07:00:55
So, the engine does turn over?
You may be giving us ambiguous and confusing info. When you say, "engine doesn't turn over," we interpret that as seized engine that does not rotate. If by "doesn't turn over," you mean it isn't firing, we can't follow you because you are describing it wrong.

Do you have a service manual? If not, get one. Plenty of free PDF downloads available. Don't just start tearing into things without a clue of what you are doing. Sure path to failure.
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: mlinder on Sep 06, 2013, 09:40:57
Engine doesn't turn over = engine is stuck
Engine doesn't fire = engine turns over but doesn't run

Which one is it?
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: NJ Cam on Sep 06, 2013, 11:18:01
I agree "engine doesn't turn over" was probably the wrong term, or a premature assessment at this point.

When I kick start it I hear the unit turning & I can also push it with no issues...when I had her gassed it sounded like she almost started but then gas started coming out the bottom of the right Carb (under the float bowl).
 
 I have yet to pull the side cover and try and turn the crankshaft....I can attempt that tonight.
 I will also be checking the left coil to determine the no spark issue on that side.   

Also yes I have a hard copy of the Clymer  that I have been using/studying.

Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: mlinder on Sep 06, 2013, 11:34:20
OK, so engine turns, it just doesn't run.

That puts you much further ahead than your original post alluded to.
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: NJ Cam on Sep 10, 2013, 21:51:55
Little update, sorry I was a tad busy over the weekend.

Left coil gives me no reading when I try to kick start.
Right coil does which makes sense since its giving me a spark.

I back tracked the wires from the left coil to see if I saw an issue there, nothing was visibly disconnected but the lines were very brittle.
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: AlaskaCL350 on Sep 12, 2013, 15:04:24
Hey there,

I am pretty deep into a CB350 rebuild / cafe project as well. 

Things that I've come across in my journey that may help you:
- Respect the carbs.  Clean them, rebuild them, and give them love.  Confirm floats are set correctly and that jets are original specs.
- As stated earlier, three things that make the motor run: spark, air, and fuel.  Confirm these three systems are / are not working before buying a ton of parts.
- Coils are fairly reliable, but depending on what type you have "replacing the wires" may not be possible. (I may be incorrect on this... but I have a type that seems to be hard wired into the coils)
- These bikes love a well charged battery to ensure a good spark
- Go through your wiring harness and confirm that you have excellent grounding through out the system.  This can solve a lot of electrical gremlins
- There are a ton of guides available through this site to do just about EVERYTHING on this bike from electrical troubleshooting to carb sync'ing.  Do your research, read a lot, and prevent hours of frustration.

A lot of good information is available on this thread: http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=49679.0
Give it a good read and it'll get you started on a few places to check.

I'll be subscribing and hopefully will be able to help throughout.

-T
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: NJ Cam on Sep 17, 2013, 13:17:53
Update & some pics tomorrow. Been busy moving my GF in.... so garage time has been limited, but studying and reading has not stopped  ::)

New Coils, Plugs, Wire, & Condenser are here.

I will be installing/ re-wiring and adjusting points and timing tomorrow, spent all my garage time this past week getting the generator and oil covers off  :-[ what a pain...as well as some tank clean up.

Also per many suggestions I will using a real battery(instead of my jumper)...I have noticed that the spark I did get previously was not that great (light orange). 
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: NJ Cam on Nov 19, 2013, 12:57:29
Update. After a break in the build I got her started and idling last night....if only for a few seconds  ;D
2 Lil vids attached
http://youtu.be/3dSqmxB1joo (http://youtu.be/3dSqmxB1joo)
http://youtu.be/O6ad6dp0fIY (http://youtu.be/O6ad6dp0fIY)

Found a small leak in the fuel tank behind the Honda symbol  so that's next on my list to fix...you can see the plastic cup catching the leak in the vid.

Question for you experts, when I turn the petcock to "reserve" only one side seems to flow fuel vs full "open" with a full tank both sides flow....thoughts?

Also any other suggestions are welcome especially based on what you heard/saw in the vid.

Thanks
Cam
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: NJ Cam on Nov 25, 2013, 16:52:26
Following up with a vid of the petcock issue...only flowing from one side.
Will try taking it apart and looking for clogs tonight.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ppIIgSAPWns&feature=c4-overview&list=UUou-hseu0wSza5nmTaMXJRg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ppIIgSAPWns&feature=c4-overview&list=UUou-hseu0wSza5nmTaMXJRg)
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: NJ Cam on Dec 05, 2013, 11:44:42
Since getting her started and idling...I figured I'd move on to a fun/cheap winter project since I wont have funds for tires/brakes/chain with Christmas around the corner....Gotta keep the GF happy so I get garage time.

Started with a wood seat base mounted on the existing hardware so it will use the seat lock and hinges.
Cut out a place for my battery and other electrical.

Then foamed/sanded/taped and Frankenstein'ed it until I got a decent shape mold I will fiberglass in the next few weeks.

Pic1: Wood Base fitting prior to mounting/cutting (used 1inch thick pine)
Pic2: Base mounted  with battery box  cutout
Pic3: Foam blocks glued up....(fyi the foam glue sucks!) ended up using foam, a bucket, and wood to finally get my shape.
Pic4: Rough Mold sitting on the bike ...angled up due to cross bar but will sit level...also will mold in a tail light once it comes in.
Puc5: Getting closer
Pic6: Went over it again with a waxier tape
Pic7: Added a slightly raised fin down the middle
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: NJ Cam on Dec 05, 2013, 11:49:12
MOAR
Title: Re: 72 CL350 - Cafe Project 13 - Luck is not a factor for this noob
Post by: NJ Cam on Dec 05, 2013, 11:51:54
last few...more to come once the tail light is in