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Author Topic: Living Room Build - Notes on taps/dies  (Read 18255 times)

Offline rock2d2

  • Posts: 200
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Re: Living Room Build
« Reply #60 on: Jun 11, 2012, 23:38:58 »
Watching!
We regret to inform you that the Future has been cancelled.  Please plan accordingly.

"Tk-421" bolt on thread http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=38120.0

Offline Fox

  • Posts: 406
  • I've still got those patches...
Re: Living Room Build
« Reply #61 on: Jun 11, 2012, 23:46:30 »
Hehe, it's these unexpected posts that remind me I have this thread.

My Dad and I spent about 4 hours trying to get the CL started this weekend. I gerry-rigged my new ignition coils (Read:Zipties), but it was all to no avail. We had a strong spark, good compression, and fuel in the bowls (Even sprayed staring ether directly into the cylinder and into the carbs. Like I said, no dice.

I'm thinking it's timing, but who really knows. We'll be doing a thorough going over sometime soon (hopefully). I just want this thing to run to be honest. Tough to stay motivated when I work all weekend and get no results, and when the bike is 45 minutes away. Stick with me, I'll get it. Just takes more time now. That's all for now!
"Don't concentrate on the finger, or you'll miss ALL that heavenly glory."

1975 Honda CL360-Build Thread

Offline 1chrisb

  • Posts: 214
Re: Living Room Build
« Reply #62 on: Jun 12, 2012, 00:29:41 »
I just may beat you yet! Muahahahaaaa...

Offline Fox

  • Posts: 406
  • I've still got those patches...
Re: Living Room Build
« Reply #63 on: Apr 04, 2014, 20:00:52 »
Hello everybody,

Been a while. Hope you are all well and your bikes are even better.

About a month out from graduating from college which means I have a good bit of time now and will have even more after May 10, so I figured I'd get back in the swing of things and see if I can't get this thing started and road worthy.

It's hard to remember everything that was going on way back when, but from what I recall, I ran into issues with screw breaking in my engine. I haven't looked again because I was just getting my work bench set up to start working again today, but I remember need to buy a tap/dye set before everything slowed down on the project. So, searching craiglsit for one of those now.

Will post more as more things get done. Just a quick one to say I'm back.
"Don't concentrate on the finger, or you'll miss ALL that heavenly glory."

1975 Honda CL360-Build Thread

Offline DesmoBro

  • Posts: 2398
  • Busted Nut
Re: Living Room Build
« Reply #64 on: Apr 04, 2014, 20:05:30 »
Good to have u back
"I desire the things that will destroy me in the end"

Offline Fox

  • Posts: 406
  • I've still got those patches...
Re: Living Room Build
« Reply #65 on: Apr 14, 2014, 17:26:58 »
So rethreading is proving to a bit of a challenge as most places around here don't have the dies that I need. I got taps though and have been working, thought I'd post a few things I'd learned, might be useful for anyone out there looking to do some rethreading...

1. You're best bet if you want to start working is to buy a kit and start building from there. I tried to buy piecemeal, but found that I got mixed up with what exactly is the right thread, and does this tap actually fit what I've got... Not something you want to be thinking as you grind off metal inside your engine. A set makes it nice and easy to know what you've got, and if you find you need more taps, you can always add later. I just ordered this one. I'll post some pictures and notes on quality when it comes in.

2. If that price tag is a bit scary, you can get by without buying T-handles and all that and just use an adjustable wrench. Not as easy when the engine is in the frame, but it does alright.

3. Put a few drops of oil in the hole or on the bolt when you're rethreading. Helps make things turn smoother and makes the metal shavings stick to the tap/die better so they're not staying in your engine.

4. Don't turn the tap ALL the way down on the first go around. Give the tap a half turn and then backtrack. Imagine on a clock. Go from 12 to 6, then back to 12. Return to 6, turn to 12, back to 6. And so on.

5. If you sand blast your engine YOU MUST TAP YOUR HOLES!!!! Someone told me to do this when I was asking about blasting my engine block and I didn't listen and now I have a broken bolt in my head because of it. The amount of crud I've pulled out of some of these holes is pretty incredible. No wonder the bolts wouldn't turn...

6. Go slow.

7. Make sure your tap is straight when you start it. It should go in with a little resistance, but just make sure you've got it on right. I was worried about messing this up, but most times the tap sort of found it's way.

8. CL360 needs a 10x1.25 for the 8 bolts on the head and a 6mmx1.00 for the 6 other bolts, for anyone out there wondering. 10mm and 6mm are a pretty common bolt on this and many other bikes, so they're not bad to have around.

That's all I've got at the moment. Happy to answer questions if anyone has em.
« Last Edit: Apr 14, 2014, 17:29:03 by Fox »
"Don't concentrate on the finger, or you'll miss ALL that heavenly glory."

1975 Honda CL360-Build Thread

Offline SONIC.

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Re: Living Room Build - Notes on taps/dies
« Reply #66 on: Apr 14, 2014, 17:38:30 »
Price tag doesn't need to be scary, you can buy a cheap set for use in aluminum up front and then add good ones as you go to tap into steel. I have had good luck with cheap taps and dies, you just have to be careful not to break them off in the hole haha.
As for sandblasting, this is true. Your best bet is to get a dental pick and loosen up the packed in sand and then vacuum it out, repeat this a few times and then tap. If its packed in there the tap isnt going to do any good.

Offline Fox

  • Posts: 406
  • I've still got those patches...
Re: Living Room Build - Notes on taps/dies
« Reply #67 on: Apr 14, 2014, 19:03:48 »
Price tag doesn't need to be scary, you can buy a cheap set for use in aluminum up front and then add good ones as you go to tap into steel. I have had good luck with cheap taps and dies, you just have to be careful not to break them off in the hole haha.
As for sandblasting, this is true. Your best bet is to get a dental pick and loosen up the packed in sand and then vacuum it out, repeat this a few times and then tap. If its packed in there the tap isnt going to do any good.

Yeah, that's a way to go about it. I saw quite a few 40 pc. sets for $35ish. Thought about it, but I just prefer to get good stuff up front that way I don't got to worry about it later.

A few more tips on tapping,

9. A toothbrush works wonders for cleaning off the goopy crap when you pull the tap out.

10. After you've run the tap through once to set the threads, reapply oil and run it though again to get anything else from the hole. Repeat until tap comes out clean.

and a photo to show you some of the nasty stuff that comes out of your engine...
"Don't concentrate on the finger, or you'll miss ALL that heavenly glory."

1975 Honda CL360-Build Thread

Offline fresh_c

  • Posts: 233
Re: Living Room Build
« Reply #68 on: Apr 14, 2014, 22:11:46 »
2. If that price tag is a bit scary, you can get by without buying T-handles and all that and just use an adjustable wrench. Not as easy when the engine is in the frame, but it does alright.

5. If you sand blast your engine YOU MUST TAP YOUR HOLES!!!! Someone told me to do this when I was asking about blasting my engine block and I didn't listen and now I have a broken bolt in my head because of it. The amount of crud I've pulled out of some of these holes is pretty incredible. No wonder the bolts wouldn't turn...

Taps in particular are not somewhere to be cheap.  If you can't afford a set, buy the sizes you need as you need them.  Buy American.  Most of what you wrote is spot on, but there are a couple points I don't agree with.

#2 - Not a good idea to use an adjustable wrench since it side loads the tap and WILL break smaller taps.  T-handles are cheap and essential to properly turning the tap.

#5  If you are working with holes that are already tapped, you should be using a tap make specifically for rethreading.  A standard tap will remove material from the threads, causing weaker holes, but a rethreading tap restores the threads without removing material.

I'll add #11, do it right the first time because removing a broken tap is worse than slamming you hand in the car door.

Offline xb33bsa

  • Posts: 7726
Re: Living Room Build
« Reply #69 on: Apr 14, 2014, 22:32:18 »
Taps in particular are not somewhere to be cheap.  If you can't afford a set, buy the sizes you need as you need them.  Buy American.  Most of what you wrote is spot on, but there are a couple points I don't agree with.

#2 - Not a good idea to use an adjustable wrench since it side loads the tap and WILL break smaller taps.  T-handles are cheap and essential to properly turning the tap.

#5  If you are working with holes that are already tapped, you should be using a tap make specifically for rethreading.  A standard tap will remove material from the threads, causing weaker holes, but a rethreading tap restores the threads without removing material.

I'll add #11, do it right the first time because removing a broken tap is worse than slamming you hand in the car door.

well said
and if you must sand/bead/media blast any parts with threaded holes just plug them with some spare screws/bolts  use some wax to seal the threads when doing so
to sand blast something and just fill the unprotected threaded holes with gritty media , is just silly
same goes for any oil passages seal em up first
« Last Edit: Apr 15, 2014, 04:23:13 by xb33bsa »