collapse

www.dimecitycycles.com

https://www.townmoto.com/collections/vanson-leathers


www.restocycle.com

www.CITYLIMITMOTO.com

www.jadusmotorcycleparts.com

www.bisonmotorsports.com

www.speedmotoco.com

www.lostapostlejewelry.com

www.cognitomoto.com

www.sparckmoto.com

www.pistonsociety.com

www.steeltowngarage.com


Author Topic: CL360 Acceptable Cam Surface?  (Read 959 times)

Offline KY

  • Posts: 6
CL360 Acceptable Cam Surface?
« on: Mar 03, 2017, 15:46:36 »
Hey Fellas,
Been creepin' around here for a while checking out builds and stuff for a couple years but never really had any reason to post until now.  I haven't tore too many motors apart and I figured I would ask the guys who have experience with these motors.

I have been messing with a CL360 on and off when I have free time and am actually motivated to work on it.  I bought the bike mostly assembled and got it running in July of '15.  I tore it apart last fall to go a different route with the build and now I am assessing the motor.  I was told by the PO that it had been rebuilt by a shop and been gone through.  As I have been checking things it seems like someone definitely has spent some time inside the motor but to what extent, I'm not quite sure yet.  I've had both side case covers off to check the clutch and replace a leaky gasket on the right side and delete the starter/replace leaky gasket on the left side.  The whole motor has been cleaned and repainted also so still another reason it seems like the PO's comment of the motor being gone through sounds logical.

On to my issue and what I'm actually getting at.....

Today I decided to take the rocker cover off because I have an oil leak coming from the camshaft seal.  I also have a different rocker cover because the one that is on there right now was messed up at some point because the screw that holds the tach cable in place has been busted off and someone screwed up the cable mounting location by trying to drill it out.  So I figured I might as well take a look at the chain tensioners and bearing surfaces of the cam while I had the cover off.  What I discovered is that the center bearing surface is scored slightly on the cam.  I am wondering if this is acceptable wear or if it is going to need to be fixed/replaced before I move along with my original intentions.  I haven't gotten the cam out yet so I don't have a picture of the bearing surface where it seats in the head yet, just of the cam and the cover surfaces.

Sorry for the lengthy intro and for my lack of knowledge.  I don't have much experience tearing motors apart but that's why I am asking for advice.  Thanks in advance!


Online irk miller

  • DTT SUPPORTER
  • *
  • DTT BOTM WINNER
  • *
  • Posts: 8003
  • You've been mostly-dead all day.
Re: CL360 Acceptable Cam Surface?
« Reply #1 on: Mar 03, 2017, 15:52:46 »
Looks like that can be polished out.  There's actually spalling going on with the rockers.  That's something to monitor, as well. 

Offline redwillissuperman

  • Posts: 1000
  • Keep it simple- engine, wheels, bars
Re: CL360 Acceptable Cam Surface?
« Reply #2 on: Mar 03, 2017, 18:06:24 »
Hey Fellas,
Been creepin' around here for a while checking out builds and stuff for a couple years but never really had any reason to post until now.  I haven't tore too many motors apart and I figured I would ask the guys who have experience with these motors.

I have been messing with a CL360 on and off when I have free time and am actually motivated to work on it.  I bought the bike mostly assembled and got it running in July of '15.  I tore it apart last fall to go a different route with the build and now I am assessing the motor.  I was told by the PO that it had been rebuilt by a shop and been gone through.  As I have been checking things it seems like someone definitely has spent some time inside the motor but to what extent, I'm not quite sure yet.  I've had both side case covers off to check the clutch and replace a leaky gasket on the right side and delete the starter/replace leaky gasket on the left side.  The whole motor has been cleaned and repainted also so still another reason it seems like the PO's comment of the motor being gone through sounds logical.

On to my issue and what I'm actually getting at.....

Today I decided to take the rocker cover off because I have an oil leak coming from the camshaft seal.  I also have a different rocker cover because the one that is on there right now was messed up at some point because the screw that holds the tach cable in place has been busted off and someone screwed up the cable mounting location by trying to drill it out.  So I figured I might as well take a look at the chain tensioners and bearing surfaces of the cam while I had the cover off.  What I discovered is that the center bearing surface is scored slightly on the cam.  I am wondering if this is acceptable wear or if it is going to need to be fixed/replaced before I move along with my original intentions.  I haven't gotten the cam out yet so I don't have a picture of the bearing surface where it seats in the head yet, just of the cam and the cover surfaces.

Sorry for the lengthy intro and for my lack of knowledge.  I don't have much experience tearing motors apart but that's why I am asking for advice.  Thanks in advance!

Really rebuilt motors don't leak.  "Rebuilt" with paint motors leak.

I once had a guy tell me how he took a motor to a shop to be rebuilt. It was an expensive rebuild.  They used TWO CANS of primer and FOUR CANS of hi-heat BBQ paint....

Offline Supergyro

  • Posts: 55
Re: CL360 Acceptable Cam Surface?
« Reply #3 on: Mar 04, 2017, 03:07:13 »
Hard to tell by the pics, but that journal has some life left if carefully polished. I'm not totally sure on the rocker spalling. You'll have to check if the lobes are spalled or scored to match I'd imagine.

Offline KY

  • Posts: 6
Re: CL360 Acceptable Cam Surface?
« Reply #4 on: Mar 08, 2017, 00:07:34 »
Oh crap...
I finally got the cam and head off tonight.  I feel a little less confident now that I see what was hiding under the center cam journal but I'll take input yet again.

Left side looks pretty good.


Definitely some metal transfer going on here in the middle.


Right side also looks pretty good to me.


Bit of a ridge wore into left journal surface.


This is after some minor polishing to the center.  Some definite pitting from metal transfer.


Looks like I didn't get a pic of the right cam bearing surface.  I believe it also had a slight ridge wore into it.
Here is the center pocket after some minor polishing.


Well, let me know what you guys think.

Offline nismoman8899

  • Posts: 59
Re: CL360 Acceptable Cam Surface?
« Reply #5 on: Mar 09, 2017, 01:25:06 »
I have a damaged head the metal surface on the middle was basically destoyed , i ended up buying a used one on ebay for about  45 bucks, im taking irk miller advice and polishing the newer ones journals. Picked up an nos rocker cover for 80 and 2 good shape rockers for 30ish to replace my bad ones. You can compare  yours to mine in my build thread , i am no expert ha i took tge advice of others aswell.

Offline KY

  • Posts: 6
Re: CL360 Acceptable Cam Surface?
« Reply #6 on: Mar 09, 2017, 11:04:52 »
I have a damaged head the metal surface on the middle was basically destoyed , i ended up buying a used one on ebay for about  45 bucks, im taking irk miller advice and polishing the newer ones journals. Picked up an nos rocker cover for 80 and 2 good shape rockers for 30ish to replace my bad ones. You can compare  yours to mine in my build thread , i am no expert ha i took tge advice of others aswell.

Yea, I'm debating on what to do with the head right now.  I have another cover that is in better shape that I needed to swap out anyway.  At some point someone busted the set screw off that holds the tach cable in place.  Then they tried to drill it out and messed it up even more.  I could still run that cover if I don't want to run a tach.  I think the journal on the cover could be polished up and work fine.  I just need to do a little more polishing on the head and cam journal/bearing surfaces and decide if they need to be replaced.

I'm also curious if a replaceable journal could be made for the center one on the head because it does not contain any oil supply valleys.  I think it could be done but I don't see where anyone has attempted it.

Online irk miller

  • DTT SUPPORTER
  • *
  • DTT BOTM WINNER
  • *
  • Posts: 8003
  • You've been mostly-dead all day.
Re: CL360 Acceptable Cam Surface?
« Reply #7 on: Mar 09, 2017, 11:11:09 »
Here's the center bearing on a DR350 I just modified the head on.  I turned down the cam, then milled open the journals. 



A split oil bronze bushing for the center journal, and needle bearings for the two end journals...



Another option would be to just mill down the cam and run needle bearings with the stock journal dimension.  The DR head had collected material on the journals and grooved the cam, so I had no choice but to mill the head.

Offline KY

  • Posts: 6
Re: CL360 Acceptable Cam Surface?
« Reply #8 on: Mar 09, 2017, 11:19:48 »
Here's the center bearing on a DR350 I just modified the head on.  I turned down the cam, then milled open the journals. 



A split oil bronze bushing for the center journal, and needle bearings for the two end journals...



Another option would be to just mill down the cam and run needle bearings with the stock journal dimension.  The DR head had collected material on the journals and grooved the cam, so I had no choice but to mill the head.

Thanks for sharing irk!  That is exactly what I was thinking for the center, I didn't even think about needle bearings for the ends though.  Nice work on that one!

Do you think there would be a possibility of the center split bushing trying to spin inside the milled "pocket" over time?
« Last Edit: Mar 09, 2017, 11:24:04 by KY »