1975 Suzuki T500 IT IS ALIVE! First start video 5/7/11

[teazer]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

So far so good. I'd add a pair of straight tubes from just above the swingarm pivot to the steering head ( actually to the top frame tubes where that top tube meets them. That supposedly makes a hug difference to frame stiffness and handling.

A TR500 looks works well.

Or try this for style clues
http://www.suzuki2strokes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=1874

 

[Wingspan]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

So far so good. I'd add a pair of straight tubes from just above the swingarm pivot to the steering head ( actually to the top frame tubes where that top tube meets them. That supposedly makes a hug difference to frame stiffness and handling.

Here's everything you could ever want to know about turning your T500 into a race bike:

http://www.ozebook.com/compendium/t500prep.htm

I haven't decided if I'm bracing the frame or not. This, like many other things we've talked about, falls into the "good for a race bike, but not necessary for a street bike" category IMO. My project is most definitely 100% intended to be a street bike. I'm not racing and I doubt I'd ever realize any benefit from welding in tubes, shortening the swing arm, relocating the shock mounts, or any of the other tricks vintage racers do to prepare the T500 for knee-dragging action on the track.

 

[jlgace]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

Did the seller of the chambers have any recommendations to capitalize? You can likely do a little exhaust porting to take advantage of your chambers. It should wake up the bike a fair amount without ruining street manners. Another thing that seems to be common is machining 1 - 1.5mm off the heads.

 

[Wingspan]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

Did the seller of the chambers have any recommendations to capitalize? You can likely do a little exhaust porting to take advantage of your chambers. It should wake up the bike a fair amount without ruining street manners. Another thing that seems to be common is machining 1 - 1.5mm off the heads.

I haven't discussed it with them. They did say that going up a jet may be necessary. I'm going to do whats necessary to make it as reliable as I can and leave it at that. First thing is to get my vacuum rig set up to test the crank seals. If they are still intact, I may not even open the case. I do have a new set of crank seals on hand if I do decide to change them. I'm leaning toward changing them no matter what, just to eliminate the worry. The cylinders look to be in good shape, but I'll measure them and make a decision on rings/pistons. I'm staying with the stock porting and heads. Whatever I end up doing to the engine will just be to freshen it up and make it reliable.

If it looks decent and is reliable to ride then I will have accomplished my goals.

(I'm starting to feel like a broken record here...)

 

[teazer]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

Good idea to strip the motor and replace the outer seals. Check for the oil dam conversion/update as well.

Chambers look great and work best with porting and CR that matches the pipes, but you know that already. What you don't need is a race bike on the street with stock street gearbox ratios. That would be no fun at all. While the barrels are off, I'd clean up all the ports and make sure they are all the same height. They can be widened slightly which will give you more port time area but the same timing, so slightly more power but no drop at the bottom end.

Frame bracing will improve handling even at street speeds but more to the point here, it looks cool too.

 

[Wingspan]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

Good idea to strip teh motor and replace teh outer seals. Check for the oil dam conversion/update as well.

I'll likely have the crank rebuilt with the fresh seals. I already have the parts and it's not a huge expense to have the crank rebuilt. Being a '75, my bike already has the increased oil capacity. No worries there.

 

[jlgace]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

(I'm starting to feel like a broken record here...)

Sorry, it is hard for some of us to grasp leaving free/very cheap hp on the table For me, it's one of the reasons I like the old bikes. There's no 'big gains' to be had on a modern sportbike w/o the accompaniment of 'big $' usually. It's not entirely a matter of performance though. When I'm working on a 2-stroke I like to clean up the ports regardless and portmatch the barrels to the crankcase as well as true the heads and barrels to correct for any warpage. What I was getting at though is that your chambers will be 'tuned' for a certain port-timing that is probably not stock and for a nice-running machine you might want to know what that required tuning is. Hopefully it's not too 'racy' either. And sorry, I have no idea how 2-stroke friendly you are. Don't worry about reliability though. You're not going to add enough power to remotely stress that engine, nor are you going to make it near peaky enough to require the close-ratio gearsets as someone else mentioned. Proper gearing, such as dropping a tooth on the countershaft sprocket, will compensate and give you more seat-of-the-pants performance gain than anything else you're likely to do.

 

[Wingspan]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

Don't worry about reliability though. You're not going to add enough power to remotely stress that engine, nor are you going to make it near peaky enough to require the close-ratio gearsets as someone else mentioned.

I'm not worried...because (again) I'm staying with the stock porting, etc. This is my first two stroke, but I build and test aircraft engines for a living and do my homework on whatever project I take on. I'm confident that I'm headed in the right direction to satisfy my goals for the bike. If not, I can always explore other options later. That's the nice thing about a conservative approach, you can always go farther if needed. It's more difficult to go back if you change something and aren't happy with the results. I do understand and appreciate your comments, we just don't agree about what's required for my build to be a success. I look forward to seeing your build, I'm sure it'll be great. ;D

 

[jlgace]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

That could be a long-time coming, but your build is getting me pumped about it and distracting me from my current project - an 81 CB900F. I will hopefully get enough done one day soon to put up a post. I'm tracking the progress with pics though. And hey, I know I'm going to encounter a-holes such as myself that want me to do things their way too. ;D

I'm glad to watch yours proceed though as I'm still pretty torn on the look I want. Very much digging the wrenchmonkee stuff these days... dying to see this tank you've got coming. I know it's gonna totally transform the look and I completely agree with you about the proportions of the tank on this bike.

 

[teazer]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

Bloody cheek. making your own decisions based on careful thinking. If that ever gets out, there will be hell to pay. : ;D

Just joking obviously.

All BS aside, though it seems to me that very few bikes here are carefully designed to function better than the OEM designed. Many are a little lighter but few are carefully thought out with a clear vision of what they want to achieve. There are of course exceptions and some are quite exceptional.

It's nice to read that someone has a vision and can fine tune the details as they go along, based on input which is carefully considered against the objective. Good one. Keep it up and we can all learn from your example.

BTW, what sort of aircraft engines? I started off working for Rolls Royce in the UK doing jet engine overhauls and I loved to see them in a test cell going through their paces. I also shared an office with the chief engine failure analysts and learned a lot for him - lots more to learn though.

 

[crazypj]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

I had a GT500 for a while,main difference was disc brake and GT750 tank
I sold it to my brother, the Flying Banana (it was yellow and would 'bend' in the middle ;D)
Biggest issue isn't frame, it's the super long flexible swing arm.
power on it tightens up left handers, power off it goes right (even on left handers )
You can corner on the stock silencers real easy, they act as skids 8)

 

[Wingspan]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

dying to see this tank you've got coming. I know it's gonna totally transform the look and I completely agree with you about the proportions of the tank on this bike.

I think it'll be good. I tried very hard to like the stock tank. Swapping tanks is one area where I've changed course, I was dead set against it early on. However, after staring at the bike for a few months I just couldn't find the right picture in my head of my bike with that tank. Hopefully I'll hear from Sean soon, the post office tried to deliver the stock tank Saturday and there was no one there to accept it.

 

[Wingspan]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

BTW, what sort of aircraft engines? I started off working for Rolls Royce in the UK doing jet engine overhauls and I loved to see them in a test cell going through their paces. I also shared an office with the chief engine failure analysts and learned a lot for him - lots more to learn though.

What a coincidence. I work in assembly and test for Rolls-Royce here in Indianapolis. I've been with RR for ~15 years. I too started out doing overhauls, then into new production. After 5-6 years of that I decided to try something new and went out on the shop floor and did some CNC stuff and heat treating before returning to assembly and test 4 years ago. I've worked in every assembly area we have here, but the test cells are by far my favorite job and where I'm currently assigned. I put a few hours on an RR300 helicopter engine today. ;D

 

[teazer]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

It's a small world indeed. Love you RC planes BTW.

 

[Wingspan]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

Small update on the new tank. Roc City has the old tank in hand. Sean said everything looks straightforward and that his CR tank will be the best bet for the bike, so that's what we're doing. Now I'm just waiting my turn in his build queue.

My current vision of the bike's appearance is a black frame with the polished tank and the rest of the bodywork (tail/oil tank/ battery cover/ft. fender) in red. I haven't decided if the wheels are going to stay polished and chrome or I if want to do the black hub and rim with stainless spokes. My stock spokes are pretty rusty so I'll be replacing those. I sent an email to Buchanan's Spoke & Rim as the T500 kit isn't listed on their site but haven't gotten a reply yet. I have to admit, I'm tempted to go for the cheaper spoke kits on Ebay...but with all the hassle involved in re-lacing the wheels I'd rather go with the better parts.

 

[Royal]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

I sent an email to Buchanan's Spoke & Rim as the T500 kit isn't listed on their site but haven't gotten a reply yet. I have to admit, I'm tempted to go for the cheaper spoke kits on Ebay...but with all the hassle involved in re-lacing the wheels I'd rather go with the better parts.

Hi,

These guys are worth a shot too: http://www.woodyswheelworks.com/

They are highly recommended on ADV rider and those guys put their wheels through a lot. I get the impression they build strong wheels.

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=145899

Cheers,

R

 

[Wingspan]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

Hi,

These guys are worth a shot too: http://www.woodyswheelworks.com/

They are highly recommended on ADV rider and those guys put their wheels through a lot. I get the impression they build strong wheels.

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=145899

Cheers,

R

I absolutely would to to Woody if I were going to pay to have the wheels built. He does do very nice work. I've actually already been in contact with him about building the wheels. He quoted me $220 per wheel for new spokes and lacing. That's a fair price but I'm going to buy the spokes and lace them myself. Woody gets his spokes from Buchanan's, so if I am just looking to buy the spokes there's no real reason not to go straight to the source. ;D

I tore the old spokes out last night:

 

[sparkymoto]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

Nice work Mark. Take good notes...I'm going to be doing the same thing for my t500 project. ;D My hubs are yellowed and weathered quite a bit so I'd like to get a mean polish on them while spokeless. Let me know if you find the stainless set. We went with the standard inexpensive chrome spoke kit on the XS project. Something I'd like to find is a set of Akront style alloy rims that you find on the TR500s and most other racers of the 70s. http://www.ozebook.com/compendium/norstedt/seeley-2.JPG

Your design description sounds great. Man it's going to be nice. The chambers you have on the way are YUM.

My service manual is on its way so i can do more homework before ripping everything apart.
Later.

 

[Wingspan]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

Nice work Mark. Take good notes...I'm going to be doing the same thing for my t500 project. ;D My hubs are yellowed and weathered quite a bit so I'd like to get a mean polish on them while spokeless. Let me know if you find the stainless set. We went with the standard inexpensive chrome spoke kit on the XS project. Something I'd like to find is a set of Akront style alloy rims that you find on the TR500s and most other racers of the 70s. http://www.ozebook.com/compendium/norstedt/seeley-2.JPG

Your design description sounds great. Man it's going to be nice. The chambers you have on the way are YUM.

My service manual is on its way so i can do more homework before ripping everything apart.
Later.

I called Buchanan's earlier today. No problem getting the spokes but they needed to know the diameter of the stock spokes first. Unfortunately I wasn't at home when I called so I couldn't check. I'll have to call them back tomorrow with the info. I need to decide if I want to polish the hubs or paint/powdercoat them black. The chrome on my rims isn't too bad and there isn't any pitting. They do have all the knicks and scratches you'd expect to find on a bike this old though, so I need to make decision there too.

My goal for the weekend is to get a test rig set up to check the crank seals. My bike didn't show any outward signs (excessive smoke, fouled plugs, etc) of a failed crank seal, but it's certainly not uncommon for these bikes. I've got a replacement set on hand but if the existing seals test well, simply cleaning up the engine becomes a tempting option. Of course, if the seals do leak then I'll be tearing it down and sending the crank off for a rebuild.

In other engine news, I decided to ditch the stock charging system and ignition. No more points! I've got a complete system on order from Powerdynamo in Germany. ;D

 

[t5001971]

Re: 1975 Suzuki T500 Call it whatever you want!

how much did that pretty charging system cost?
i think i want to go that way