JustinLonghorn
No Purple Hearts, No Blue Ribbons
Re: '77 CJ360T (Café SOS) - Just about done (for now)!
Once again, sir, I am a big fan.
Once again, sir, I am a big fan.
'77 CJ360T (Café SOS) - Calling it Done (for now...)
- Thread starter Sonreir
- Start date
Re: '77 CJ360T (Café SOS) - Just about done (for now)!
I got my battery from Amazon.com for something like $18 shipped. CB360 w/ no starter.
I got my battery from Amazon.com for something like $18 shipped. CB360 w/ no starter.
Re: '77 CJ360T (Café SOS) - Just about done (for now)!
http://www.batterysales.com/downloads/PS-1250.pdf
http://www.batterysales.com/powersonic.cfm
http://www.batterysales.com/downloads/PS-1250.pdf
http://www.batterysales.com/powersonic.cfm
crazypj
Split personality, I fake being smart
Re: '77 CJ360T (Café SOS) - Just about done (for now)!
You all know my views on miniature batteries.
The 5a/hr is about the smallest that's going to be reliable but I still recommend 7.5A/hr.
There is a real good explanation on SOHC4 by 'TwoTired'.
He uses sohc CB750 as an example
Seems people are starting to have issues with Shorai batteries on older bikes because the charging systems don't provide enough volts/amps at low rpm.
They are probably NOT a good idea unless charging system can balance load at idle (which most 70's bikes can't)
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=96331.0;all
scroll down and read TT's posts
You all know my views on miniature batteries.
The 5a/hr is about the smallest that's going to be reliable but I still recommend 7.5A/hr.
There is a real good explanation on SOHC4 by 'TwoTired'.
He uses sohc CB750 as an example
Seems people are starting to have issues with Shorai batteries on older bikes because the charging systems don't provide enough volts/amps at low rpm.
They are probably NOT a good idea unless charging system can balance load at idle (which most 70's bikes can't)
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=96331.0;all
scroll down and read TT's posts
Re: '77 CJ360T (Café SOS) - Just about done (for now)!
Thanks for the link, pj. Good read.
Any quick way to test if my charging system is balanced at idle? I did a full conversion to LEDs with a toggle switch to kill the headlight until after I'm started. Given my inability to get the bike to run well under the capacitor, I'll assume that my system is not able to give me a steady 12V at idle? If I test voltage across the cap leads, should it be 12V+ if my system is balanced?
Thanks for the link, pj. Good read.
Any quick way to test if my charging system is balanced at idle? I did a full conversion to LEDs with a toggle switch to kill the headlight until after I'm started. Given my inability to get the bike to run well under the capacitor, I'll assume that my system is not able to give me a steady 12V at idle? If I test voltage across the cap leads, should it be 12V+ if my system is balanced?
Re: '77 CJ360T (Café SOS) - Just about done (for now)!
I always thought that if you got more then 12V on the battery with the engine running, then it is charging. You typically see something like 13.4V on normal cars and motorcycles. This is the first time I have messed with vintage bikes.
I always thought that if you got more then 12V on the battery with the engine running, then it is charging. You typically see something like 13.4V on normal cars and motorcycles. This is the first time I have messed with vintage bikes.
crazypj
Split personality, I fake being smart
Re: '77 CJ360T (Café SOS) - Just about done (for now)!
CB/CJ doesn't 'load balance' until around 1,800~2,000 rpm
Quick way to check is use digital voltmeter.
Just connect across battery, measure voltage, sart bike and watch meter at idle (it will be dropping by tenth of a volt or so)
Slowly increase rpm until it stops dropping.
Batteries don't charge with Volts, they charge with Amps.
I forget max output of CJ alternator, isn't very high (110~120watts?)
That's about 9~10 amps.
If battery is too small, you could get 9 amps (less whatever is needed for lights, etc) directly to battery
Not good, it can go 'BANG' big time and probably will eventually.
Lead acid batteries shouldn't be charged at more than one tenth of rated capacity, the smaller A/hr battery you use, the more likely you are to overcharge it.
Stock battery is 12A/hr, charging system can probably put 1.5A at max rpm, usually closer to 1A normal running
Now you know why I recommend 7.5A/hr, it's only slightly overcharging at max rpm and usually gets about all it needs
A few months ago I posted pics in Video section of checking charge amps/volts of my 360, you cansee the numbers I got at idle and max charge (about 5,000rpm)
http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=21350.0
CB/CJ doesn't 'load balance' until around 1,800~2,000 rpm
Quick way to check is use digital voltmeter.
Just connect across battery, measure voltage, sart bike and watch meter at idle (it will be dropping by tenth of a volt or so)
Slowly increase rpm until it stops dropping.
Batteries don't charge with Volts, they charge with Amps.
I forget max output of CJ alternator, isn't very high (110~120watts?)
That's about 9~10 amps.
If battery is too small, you could get 9 amps (less whatever is needed for lights, etc) directly to battery
Not good, it can go 'BANG' big time and probably will eventually.
Lead acid batteries shouldn't be charged at more than one tenth of rated capacity, the smaller A/hr battery you use, the more likely you are to overcharge it.
Stock battery is 12A/hr, charging system can probably put 1.5A at max rpm, usually closer to 1A normal running
Now you know why I recommend 7.5A/hr, it's only slightly overcharging at max rpm and usually gets about all it needs
A few months ago I posted pics in Video section of checking charge amps/volts of my 360, you cansee the numbers I got at idle and max charge (about 5,000rpm)
http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=21350.0
Re: '77 CJ360T (Café SOS) - Just about done (for now)!
I saw that after you posted, but I'll go check it out again. I think my level of current knowledge is better than it was back then and I may understand more the second time around.
One question (to anyone, actually): Is it possible to load balance an old bike at idle by reducing the power draw (through LEDs like I have, or possibly other means)?
I saw that after you posted, but I'll go check it out again. I think my level of current knowledge is better than it was back then and I may understand more the second time around.
One question (to anyone, actually): Is it possible to load balance an old bike at idle by reducing the power draw (through LEDs like I have, or possibly other means)?
crazypj
Split personality, I fake being smart
Re: '77 CJ360T (Café SOS) - Just about done (for now)!
If your using all stock parts you need about three and a half amps to run ignition, neutral light and tail light (less than half amp for bulbs/wiring)
Aftermarket coils may have a higher amp draw, depending on primary resistance
Depending on headlight bulb, you could have another 5 amps (60w main beam, 55w low)
Stock will be around 3 amps
You have around 7 amps draw on battery under normal running conditions, the generator puts out about 9 amps at max rpm
A 7.5 A/hr battery gives some 'reserve capacity' and allows the flashers to flash and brake light to light up
LED indicators and taillight will help, but, load balance isn't going to happen at idle (unless you set idle around 2,000rpm ;D )
A larger generator needs more HP to drive it which defeats the purpose of lighter weight components.
A 5A/hr is as small as I would ever go, it has about an hour run time if you end up riding at low rpm
Just 'stole' this off Two Tired post at SOHC4
The Shorai instructions warn to never allow the their battery to discharge below 13V. Further, never allow the charge voltage to go above 14.8V. The Std, peak charge voltage is 14.4V for that battery.
Seems like they are definitely NOT a good idea for our old bikes
If your using all stock parts you need about three and a half amps to run ignition, neutral light and tail light (less than half amp for bulbs/wiring)
Aftermarket coils may have a higher amp draw, depending on primary resistance
Depending on headlight bulb, you could have another 5 amps (60w main beam, 55w low)
Stock will be around 3 amps
You have around 7 amps draw on battery under normal running conditions, the generator puts out about 9 amps at max rpm
A 7.5 A/hr battery gives some 'reserve capacity' and allows the flashers to flash and brake light to light up
LED indicators and taillight will help, but, load balance isn't going to happen at idle (unless you set idle around 2,000rpm ;D )
A larger generator needs more HP to drive it which defeats the purpose of lighter weight components.
A 5A/hr is as small as I would ever go, it has about an hour run time if you end up riding at low rpm
Just 'stole' this off Two Tired post at SOHC4
The Shorai instructions warn to never allow the their battery to discharge below 13V. Further, never allow the charge voltage to go above 14.8V. The Std, peak charge voltage is 14.4V for that battery.
Seems like they are definitely NOT a good idea for our old bikes
Re: '77 CJ360T (Café SOS) - Just about done (for now)!
Not really. I've mostly been lazy, but I'm also waiting on a friend to get me a battery. He works with emergency lighting and he's got a job coming up to replace some existing units. He'll have some batteries for me to try out after the job is underway.
I also recently finished a remodel on my house and the project went over budget by a few grand, so spending $$$ on the bike right now isn't really an option. I may try to sync the carbs by feel, but I'm getting a new problem which I have yet to figure out...
When connect the fuel line to the carbs and turn on the petcock, no fuel is passing through the line and into the carbs. If I remove the line and turn on the petcock the gas pours out. I've taken apart the carbs but can't seem to find anything wrong...
Not really. I've mostly been lazy, but I'm also waiting on a friend to get me a battery. He works with emergency lighting and he's got a job coming up to replace some existing units. He'll have some batteries for me to try out after the job is underway.
I also recently finished a remodel on my house and the project went over budget by a few grand, so spending $$$ on the bike right now isn't really an option. I may try to sync the carbs by feel, but I'm getting a new problem which I have yet to figure out...
When connect the fuel line to the carbs and turn on the petcock, no fuel is passing through the line and into the carbs. If I remove the line and turn on the petcock the gas pours out. I've taken apart the carbs but can't seem to find anything wrong...
shocwav3
Been Around the Block
Re: '77 CJ360T (Café SOS) - Just about done (for now)!
Same exact thing was happening to me, I pulled the float bowl on the offending carb like 20 times. Finally I realized that the float was getting stuck in the closed postion when I was putting the bowl back on. It was tedious but I made small adjustments to the float arms until I got them in a position where they would not bind. Has not happened since.
Sonreir said:
Same exact thing was happening to me, I pulled the float bowl on the offending carb like 20 times. Finally I realized that the float was getting stuck in the closed postion when I was putting the bowl back on. It was tedious but I made small adjustments to the float arms until I got them in a position where they would not bind. Has not happened since.
