CM400T Cafe >FINISHED!
- Thread starter Frankenfe
- Start date
Re: My CM400T Cafe Build - HOME STRETCH
First, what an inspiring thread you have here! I have a question or two regarding the carbs. I think I am going to take the plunge into getting the VM30's from DCC for my '78 CB400Tii build. I am tired of messing around with the factory ones.
Did you keep the factory throttle tube and utilize just the pull function of it?
Am I correct in thinking that your factory carbs and mine are the same? I ask because you had to do something with the fittment into the factory size intake boots.
And when is the video of this bad boy running with the new carbs?!
Also, I have found a simple solution to the right side carb choke.
http://youtu.be/EesID_WiLcc?t=51s
Again, amazing build! And thank you for any input regarding my questions.
First, what an inspiring thread you have here! I have a question or two regarding the carbs. I think I am going to take the plunge into getting the VM30's from DCC for my '78 CB400Tii build. I am tired of messing around with the factory ones.
Did you keep the factory throttle tube and utilize just the pull function of it?
Am I correct in thinking that your factory carbs and mine are the same? I ask because you had to do something with the fittment into the factory size intake boots.
And when is the video of this bad boy running with the new carbs?!
Also, I have found a simple solution to the right side carb choke.
http://youtu.be/EesID_WiLcc?t=51s
Again, amazing build! And thank you for any input regarding my questions.
Frankenfe
Coast to Coast
Re: My CM400T Cafe Build - HOME STRETCH
First, what an inspiring thread you have here! Thank you very much
I have a question or two regarding the carbs. I think I am going to take the plunge into getting the VM30's from DCC for my '78 CB400Tii build. I am tired of messing around with the factory ones. . I Have been really happy with DCC Too, Don't forget that they offer a 10% Discount to DTT. See thier first thread in the "friends of DTT" section
Did you keep the factory throttle tube and utilize just the pull function of it? Yes I was only using the pull cable before anyways.
Am I correct in thinking that your factory carbs and mine are the same? I believe the CB400Ti's had diff carbs but probably same Spigot and flange opening size as the CM's. I ask because you had to do something with the fittment into the factory size intake boots.
From top of page 14
"My kit did not come with VM30 Mounting Flanges . I'm not sure I would have used them anyway to be honest. The VM30 Spigots are 40mm and the OEM Carb Spigots/Flange openings are 43mm. The VM30 Flange Mounting Hole Center to Center Distance is 60mm. the Head Stud Distance is 67mm
I like that the flange throat on the OEM mounts are effectively matched to the head port, and while I have no scientific basis, I also liked the idea that the "expansion" will occur right after the smaller spigot of the VM30 Carbs, vs after the VM30 Flange.
So I decided to fit the Carbs to the flange instead of the flanges to the head. I bought a small bicycle tube and cut 2 bands out of it about 1/2 wide then slipped them over the VM spigot and then trimmed to the edge with a razor blade. The "Rubber Band" made them fit just snug enough that I needed to put a little oil on the bands to slip them into the flange without them moving/bunching.
"The "Bands" seemed to take up the 3mm difference very well. Even though with the bands the Carbs were snugly mounted the method concerned me "down the road". I decided to utilize the Carb mounts. I "Racked" them so to speak, with a piece of 1/4" all thread rod, 2 1/4" Coupling Nuts w washers (on inside of carbs) and 2 Stainless Cap Nuts with washers (on the outside). REALLY stiffened things up & I like the added security and kinda finishes the look IMO."
And when is the video of this bad boy running with the new carbs?! I have some sorting and tuning to do before the bike is finished, I also need to have the seat upholstered. When it's all done ......
Also, I have found a simple solution to the right side carb choke.
http://youtu.be/EesID_WiLcc?t=51s
I had thought about that too, also thought about just bending the tab to the right . it would change the up/dwn choke if I did though. the reality is, I probably will very seldom even need a choke, remember I'm in Arizona. I may ultimately convert to cable actuated choke.
Again, amazing build! Thank you again...
And thank you for any input regarding my questions. I hope I have answered your questions.
First, what an inspiring thread you have here! Thank you very much
I have a question or two regarding the carbs. I think I am going to take the plunge into getting the VM30's from DCC for my '78 CB400Tii build. I am tired of messing around with the factory ones. . I Have been really happy with DCC Too, Don't forget that they offer a 10% Discount to DTT. See thier first thread in the "friends of DTT" section
Did you keep the factory throttle tube and utilize just the pull function of it? Yes I was only using the pull cable before anyways.
Am I correct in thinking that your factory carbs and mine are the same? I believe the CB400Ti's had diff carbs but probably same Spigot and flange opening size as the CM's. I ask because you had to do something with the fittment into the factory size intake boots.
From top of page 14
"My kit did not come with VM30 Mounting Flanges . I'm not sure I would have used them anyway to be honest. The VM30 Spigots are 40mm and the OEM Carb Spigots/Flange openings are 43mm. The VM30 Flange Mounting Hole Center to Center Distance is 60mm. the Head Stud Distance is 67mm
I like that the flange throat on the OEM mounts are effectively matched to the head port, and while I have no scientific basis, I also liked the idea that the "expansion" will occur right after the smaller spigot of the VM30 Carbs, vs after the VM30 Flange.
So I decided to fit the Carbs to the flange instead of the flanges to the head. I bought a small bicycle tube and cut 2 bands out of it about 1/2 wide then slipped them over the VM spigot and then trimmed to the edge with a razor blade. The "Rubber Band" made them fit just snug enough that I needed to put a little oil on the bands to slip them into the flange without them moving/bunching.
"The "Bands" seemed to take up the 3mm difference very well. Even though with the bands the Carbs were snugly mounted the method concerned me "down the road". I decided to utilize the Carb mounts. I "Racked" them so to speak, with a piece of 1/4" all thread rod, 2 1/4" Coupling Nuts w washers (on inside of carbs) and 2 Stainless Cap Nuts with washers (on the outside). REALLY stiffened things up & I like the added security and kinda finishes the look IMO."
And when is the video of this bad boy running with the new carbs?! I have some sorting and tuning to do before the bike is finished, I also need to have the seat upholstered. When it's all done ......
Also, I have found a simple solution to the right side carb choke.
http://youtu.be/EesID_WiLcc?t=51s
I had thought about that too, also thought about just bending the tab to the right . it would change the up/dwn choke if I did though. the reality is, I probably will very seldom even need a choke, remember I'm in Arizona. I may ultimately convert to cable actuated choke.
Again, amazing build! Thank you again...
And thank you for any input regarding my questions. I hope I have answered your questions.
Frankenfe
Coast to Coast
Re: My CM400T Cafe Build - HOME STRETCH
Yayuppp,
I did just remember some details about the throttle cable and Throttle Tube. so I will ramble on a bit about them.
First I need to confess that in the Christmas day type excitement of opening my Carb kit, I Misplaced (Probably threw away) my little bag that had all the Ferrules/Cable Ends. I was able to reproduce them with assorted sizes of "Modelers Tubing" in Aluminum (Finish housing ends) Brass (Throttle End) and Copper (Splitter and or Carb Ends)
This was my first experience "Finishing" or "Making" my own cables to length. Even with the make shift ends, the soldering of the ends went easy. The real work is in calculating the lengths. Hard to explain the process I used, but 1) I started at Carb ends and worked my way to the Throttle Tube. 2) Calculated the lengths with all adjusters 90% minimized.
Here is Something I did also, ....
The "Universal Cable" was basically 1) The Splitter, 2) 3 pieces of of Cable Housing, finished on 1 end each only, 3) 3 Pieces of Inner Cable finished on 1 end only with a Carb/Splitter end. 4) The bag of Ferrules (I lost) I don't think any adjusters for the throttle end are provided, there were adjuster in each carb cap.
I cut a 90- degree Adjuster from an good / old cable and used it on the throttle end. I like that it directs it toward the Triples right off with my clip ons.
Yayuppp,
I did just remember some details about the throttle cable and Throttle Tube. so I will ramble on a bit about them.
First I need to confess that in the Christmas day type excitement of opening my Carb kit, I Misplaced (Probably threw away) my little bag that had all the Ferrules/Cable Ends. I was able to reproduce them with assorted sizes of "Modelers Tubing" in Aluminum (Finish housing ends) Brass (Throttle End) and Copper (Splitter and or Carb Ends)
This was my first experience "Finishing" or "Making" my own cables to length. Even with the make shift ends, the soldering of the ends went easy. The real work is in calculating the lengths. Hard to explain the process I used, but 1) I started at Carb ends and worked my way to the Throttle Tube. 2) Calculated the lengths with all adjusters 90% minimized.
Here is Something I did also, ....
The "Universal Cable" was basically 1) The Splitter, 2) 3 pieces of of Cable Housing, finished on 1 end each only, 3) 3 Pieces of Inner Cable finished on 1 end only with a Carb/Splitter end. 4) The bag of Ferrules (I lost) I don't think any adjusters for the throttle end are provided, there were adjuster in each carb cap.
I cut a 90- degree Adjuster from an good / old cable and used it on the throttle end. I like that it directs it toward the Triples right off with my clip ons.
Re: My CM400T Cafe Build - HOME STRETCH
Thanks for adding some more information. I figured if I was going to buy brand new carbs, I might as well spend some more over at Motion Pro for a custom stainless braided cable. Still waiting on a email from them.
Also, I just recently move to Colorado and my bike is back at my parents in Texas. I will get it soon.
Do you notice any over-all better performance from the Mikunis? I know you said you were still doing some fine tuning, can you give insight?
Thanks for adding some more information. I figured if I was going to buy brand new carbs, I might as well spend some more over at Motion Pro for a custom stainless braided cable. Still waiting on a email from them.
Also, I just recently move to Colorado and my bike is back at my parents in Texas. I will get it soon.
Do you notice any over-all better performance from the Mikunis? I know you said you were still doing some fine tuning, can you give insight?
Frankenfe
Coast to Coast
Re: My CM400T Cafe Build - HOME STRETCH
I have neglected so many other things lately, unfortunately I am not going to be able to get the time to really work on it for a week or so.
I have gotten it running on the carbs, but no time spent yet tuning and have some time to really work on it.
Current / Initial Issues,
White Smoke from #1 at start ...
Idling Issues
#1 Carb Over Flow leaking
While I would normally think that the smoke would be valve seals, and overflow would be sticking float, but both may be related.
With the longer shocks that were added after mock up, my kick stand is now short and the bike leans WAY over on it , ..Confusing the Floats? Flooding Bowl and Intake? overflow and flooded at start?
In addition have not even begun to tune them so it may be awhile till I have it how I want it.
Regarding the "Custom" Motion Pro Dual, You will still need to do all the hard work ...the calculations. If by chance your off you may need to shorten or lenghthen any way...
As soon as I have it all dialed in I will report back, I know both you and TSbigDog are anxious to hear.
I have neglected so many other things lately, unfortunately I am not going to be able to get the time to really work on it for a week or so.
I have gotten it running on the carbs, but no time spent yet tuning and have some time to really work on it.
Current / Initial Issues,
White Smoke from #1 at start ...
Idling Issues
#1 Carb Over Flow leaking
While I would normally think that the smoke would be valve seals, and overflow would be sticking float, but both may be related.
With the longer shocks that were added after mock up, my kick stand is now short and the bike leans WAY over on it , ..Confusing the Floats? Flooding Bowl and Intake? overflow and flooded at start?
In addition have not even begun to tune them so it may be awhile till I have it how I want it.
Regarding the "Custom" Motion Pro Dual, You will still need to do all the hard work ...the calculations. If by chance your off you may need to shorten or lenghthen any way...
As soon as I have it all dialed in I will report back, I know both you and TSbigDog are anxious to hear.
Maritime
Over 10,000 Posts
Re: My CM400T Cafe Build - HOME STRETCH
I like the Honda logos. Should look good on a background of black tank. Good luck on the carbs and yes leaned way over can cause floats to shift on the pins a bit and stick against the side of the carb body. put a block of wood or something to straighten up the bike and tap the carb a few times to jiggle the float and see if it stops leaking.
I like the Honda logos. Should look good on a background of black tank. Good luck on the carbs and yes leaned way over can cause floats to shift on the pins a bit and stick against the side of the carb body. put a block of wood or something to straighten up the bike and tap the carb a few times to jiggle the float and see if it stops leaking.
onetruepunk87
Been Around the Block
Re: My CM400T Cafe Build - HOME STRETCH
I like it!
I like it!
Frankenfe
Coast to Coast
Re: My CM400T Cafe Build - HOME STRETCH
Well I got the last "Visual" piece installed today, the seat I had made. So I guess it is basically done. Still a little sorting like Rear brake Switch, Polish the Hubs and re-polish some of the other pieces and Fine tune the VM30's. Are they really ever Done?...
Well I got the last "Visual" piece installed today, the seat I had made. So I guess it is basically done. Still a little sorting like Rear brake Switch, Polish the Hubs and re-polish some of the other pieces and Fine tune the VM30's. Are they really ever Done?...
Attachments
onetruepunk87
Been Around the Block
Re: My CM400T Cafe Build - HOME STRETCH
Looks great! When do the nominations open for the next BOTM? Because, you're it!
Looks great! When do the nominations open for the next BOTM? Because, you're it!
Frankenfe
Coast to Coast
Re: My CM400T Cafe Build - HOME STRETCH
Thanks True Punk ..not sure it's there but I appreciate the thought. A recap of some details
1978 CB400T Fuel Tank Custom Knurled Aluminum Latch Button
Custom Steel Seat Pan & Upholstery, OE attachment points, "Hump" from Chopped & Narrowed '78 CB400 Tank w Bullet Tail Light
CL77 Headlight w Vintage Style Neutral/Hi Beam Indicators & Headlight Switch
Custom Bucket Mounted 1.9" Speedo & Tach / Dash
Universal Chrome Headlight Brackets, Skinned In Aluminum Plate.
Round Black Bar End Mirrors, Bar Mounted
Under Seat Hump "Spot" light mounted to Illuminate License Plate
Ignition Switch Mounted Under Seat through Alumimun Electrical Tray/Battery Box
Frame Mounted Starter Relay w Vintage Smooth Cover
Horn Mount Moved Under Tank, Above Valve Cover
Mikuni VM30 Carbs, & Stainless Fuel Line "Y", K&N Pod Filters with Stainless Clamps
NGK Spark Plug Caps, NGK DR8EIX Iridium Plugs
Custom Dual Exhaust, Mild Baffles, Grey Fiberglass Wrapped w Stainless Ties
Mini Chrome Air Breather
Oil Gauge, 100PSI
Magnetic Drain Plug
Laced Sprocket Cover w Aluminum Modeling Mesh
Duplicolor Silver DE1650 on Case, Polished Covers, Natural Fins
Clutch Plates & Heavy Duty Springs
530-104 O-Ring Chain
De-Tabbed Frame, Seat Filler Panels and "Lightning" Holes
Powder Coat Frame, Lower Triple, Springs - Front & Rear
CBR600 Rear Sets Welded Frame Mounts w Custom Linkage
Billet Thumb Brake Adjust Knob
CM400E Front Forks, Front Drum, 18" Front Spoked Wheel/Hub "Vented"
1971 CB350 18" Rear Wheel/Hub, Drum Brake "Vented"
Suzuki 1968 T250 Fork Helper Springs, Cups & Guides
1981 CB750F Adjustable Rear Shocks (VHD 80 – 82), New Upper & Lower Bushings
Shinko 712, 100/90-18 Front, 110/90-18 Rear
33mm Clip On Handlebars
Fork Brace, Vintage
NHK ODM-500, 6 Position, Steering Damper
All Balls Tapered Stem Bearings
Shaved & Polished Upper Triple
Thanks True Punk ..not sure it's there but I appreciate the thought. A recap of some details
1978 CB400T Fuel Tank Custom Knurled Aluminum Latch Button
Custom Steel Seat Pan & Upholstery, OE attachment points, "Hump" from Chopped & Narrowed '78 CB400 Tank w Bullet Tail Light
CL77 Headlight w Vintage Style Neutral/Hi Beam Indicators & Headlight Switch
Custom Bucket Mounted 1.9" Speedo & Tach / Dash
Universal Chrome Headlight Brackets, Skinned In Aluminum Plate.
Round Black Bar End Mirrors, Bar Mounted
Under Seat Hump "Spot" light mounted to Illuminate License Plate
Ignition Switch Mounted Under Seat through Alumimun Electrical Tray/Battery Box
Frame Mounted Starter Relay w Vintage Smooth Cover
Horn Mount Moved Under Tank, Above Valve Cover
Mikuni VM30 Carbs, & Stainless Fuel Line "Y", K&N Pod Filters with Stainless Clamps
NGK Spark Plug Caps, NGK DR8EIX Iridium Plugs
Custom Dual Exhaust, Mild Baffles, Grey Fiberglass Wrapped w Stainless Ties
Mini Chrome Air Breather
Oil Gauge, 100PSI
Magnetic Drain Plug
Laced Sprocket Cover w Aluminum Modeling Mesh
Duplicolor Silver DE1650 on Case, Polished Covers, Natural Fins
Clutch Plates & Heavy Duty Springs
530-104 O-Ring Chain
De-Tabbed Frame, Seat Filler Panels and "Lightning" Holes
Powder Coat Frame, Lower Triple, Springs - Front & Rear
CBR600 Rear Sets Welded Frame Mounts w Custom Linkage
Billet Thumb Brake Adjust Knob
CM400E Front Forks, Front Drum, 18" Front Spoked Wheel/Hub "Vented"
1971 CB350 18" Rear Wheel/Hub, Drum Brake "Vented"
Suzuki 1968 T250 Fork Helper Springs, Cups & Guides
1981 CB750F Adjustable Rear Shocks (VHD 80 – 82), New Upper & Lower Bushings
Shinko 712, 100/90-18 Front, 110/90-18 Rear
33mm Clip On Handlebars
Fork Brace, Vintage
NHK ODM-500, 6 Position, Steering Damper
All Balls Tapered Stem Bearings
Shaved & Polished Upper Triple
