Honda 360 - Left side running cool, occasional misfire

Sonreir

Oregon
DTT SUPPORTER
OK... so my Dad and I spent a few hours going through my bike yesterday and most of that time was spent working on getting it to idle better. It idles OK at the moment, but not perfect and we like to aim for perfection around here.

These are the symptoms we are currently seeing:
*Left side is running cool. Even after idling for 5 minutes, the left pipe is only warm whereas the right side is quite hot.
*Occasional misfire on the left side that goes away above 1/4 throttle. This misfire also seems to get a bit better when I unscrew the mixture screw on that side but doesn't completely go away before the RPMs start to drop from the adjustment
*Timing is where we want it, but "wanders" a bit at idle. It fluctuates a few degrees in either direction and doesn't hold steady when we strobe it. The strobe seems continue to flash when the misfire occurs so I'm not convinced (but also won't rule out just yet) the problem is spark.
*Engine still runs with idle screw all the way out. Pulling the carbs verified that butterfly valves are as closed as they're gonna get (how is this even possible?).
*Mixture screw has very little effect on the left side as compared to the right. Turning the right side more than half a turn in either direction drops the RPM whereas the left side I can unscrew it two or three turns before the RPMs drop and RPMs don't drop even with it screwed all the way in (it's currently sitting 1.5 turns out).
*We switched the mixture screws from left to right with no difference in operation
*Tried running without the mixture screws at all (completely remove them) and bike will not even start
*Compression of left side is 150 PSI, right side is 151 PSI
*Initial timing is about 25° due to domed pistons and additional duration on the cam. Retarding to stock timing values didn't change the running (in regards to the misfire), but the bike was no longer happy to take throttle and RPMs dropped enough to require adjustment of the idle screw.
*Valve clearances were reset (I had them gapped a bit too much)
*Regapped the spark plug on the left side to .040" and then down to 0.25" with little difference in running
*Tried new plugs with no difference
*Carbs have been cleaned twice since I had the engine apart with the only change from stock being a move to 115 secondary main jets

My Dad spent some time thinking about this one and we're going to search for more vacuum leaks (I already replaced the carb boots because I did have a leak, previously).

Any other ideas?
 
Re: Left side running cool, occasonal misfire

How are the tiny little holes in the pilot jet lookin'? . I had a similar issue where only one side would fire hard, the other would be intermittent and cold but my issue was actually incorrect points gaps. Since yours clears up after 1/4 I would assume its a fuel issue.
 
Had a similar issue and I had a butterfly flipped around so it wouldn't seat properly. Also found a microscopic hole in my diaphragm but im not sure that would affect idle.
 
Yeah... I checked the butteflies as well. I did have the problem previously and I was finally able to get the carbs in sync after correcting it.
 
More pieces of the puzzle:

I bypassed by Hondaman ignition unit and ran straight from points. The left side didn't misfire anymore, but it's possible it wasn't running at all. It runs so cold I can't really tell and I didn't have a chance to ride it to see.

Also... I had the carbs off. The back of the butterfly on the left side is covered in oily soot. Looks to be a mixture of gas and carbon.
 
Re-check valve clearance and re-sync carbs.
I think pilot jet hole is about 0.012"~0.013" if your running stock 38 pilot jet (I know a 0.012" drill fits through it)
valves tend to bed in when you lap them, I always set an extra 0.001" clearance and re-check after first run then re-set again after 100 miles
If you have a spare set of carbs, mail them to me and I'll 'fix' them ;)
 
it certainly sounds like the left side is hardly firing at low revs.

possible causes include:

Partially blocked pilot jet
Partially blocked pilot jet air feed
Inlet valve not closing properly

As PJ and others suggested, start with the valve clearances and then do a compression check to confirm that both sides are more or less equal.

Then pull the carbs off and clean them again. one trick i always recommend is spray carb cleaner through one passageway on one carb and repeat on the other carb before moving to another drilling. That gives you a quick comparison between the two carbs one circuit at a time.
 
I've been using a x10 jewelers loupe to check jets for a number of years
A lot have 'fur' inside so look good but have restricted flow.
Carb cleaner or compressed air passes through OK but without knowing the flow you don't know if it's good enough.
Burnishing with copper wire usually works but if not, I've been running really tiny drills through some pilot jets and emulsion tube cross drillings (0.010"~0.012" dia)
Problem is, drills can open up jets (and they also break real easy in the micro sizes)
Ordered another $45.00 in micro drills last Friday ;D
 
Back
Top Bottom