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Hey guys, I have completed my 75 cl360 cafe racer project in all aspects except for one. The clutch won't budge!
During the build, I replaced the clutch springs with heavy duty ones, and also replaced the clutch cable and adjustment screw. I've adjusted and adjusted according to manual specs. The ball bearing is there. I think I've got it where I need it, however the rear wheel won't turn when in gear and the clutch lever pulled in.
So I understand that a wet clutch may seize if sat for too long without oil. So what's the best course of action? I've tried rolling it back and forth to no avail. My next step would be to start the bike on center stand, shift into gear and pop the rear brake to free it once warmed up. My concern is that I won't get a proper break in running the bike without load. Not to mention the danger of trashing the bike if it runs away.
I promise a build thread and pics are coming soon. Just need your help to figure this out first.
Should have pulled the clutch plates apart and cleaned them while you were there.
Best course of action is to pull the clutch cover and verify that your clutch is attempting to disengage. If the outside clutch plate moves then pull the clutch apart and clean and inspect it. If it doesn't move you have other problems.
I've heard of other people push starting the bike in say second gear and then riding it around until the oil washes the clutch loose. Be kind of spooky if you don't have a good area without stop signs to ride on for a while.
Tie the lever back to the grip and leave it sit for a while, like over night or longer. Starting the engine and blipping the throttle with the lever tied back will help also. My old Triumph is so bad the clutch will stick if I leave it sit over night so I always have the lever tied to the grip. Common problem with Triumphs.
Thanks for the input, guys. I was trying to avoid pulling the engine cover since I don't have a spare gasket lying around, but I think I might have to. Ill try cleaning and soaking the plates in oil before reinstall.
Have any of you guys experienced this when switching to heavy duty springs?
Had an experience with this this spring. A friend built an XS650 bobber and when complete the clutch was stuck with no success breaking it loose by rocking it or dropping into gear while reving the motor with the clutch pulled. We ended up pulling the clutch plates and found that the metal plates had formed slight rust from sitting without oil for too long. The moisture in the air in the garage and the temperature changes created the perfect conditions for the flash rust to form.
Believe it or not we had to pull everyone of the plates before the clutch basket would release. We removed the rust from the plates with a scuff pad, there were some stains left, which we should have completely removed, because if the bike sits for a week or so the clutch will drag or lock to some degree.
Alright guys, I took off the clutch cover and inspected. Clutch is assembled correctly and the plates should be spinning fine. I soaked everything in oil and reinstalled. Looks to be a case of clutch actuator popping, where the rotating actuator doesn't return to normal resting position. Mine however, is so off it doesn't even pop, like its already past that point. I've tried removing the locknut at the perch for more slack, helped a little, still nothing. It seems that the DCC perch I'm using and the notoriously short motion pro cable aren't allowing me enough slack with my setup (clip ons).
So, my next question for you guys: How can i shorten the clutch cable housing without cutting off the nipples? pipe cutter and some heat shrink to seal it shut?
I know the clutch pop topic has been beaten to death already. Just cant find a decent method for this cable mod.
Use a small cutting wheel on Dremel.
Craft knife to remove the plastic sheath then you can see the metal coil underneath
Cut straight and just be careful not to nick inner wire.
The cut will look angled but really it's because the outer is coiled flat spring steel
I managed to get take a second lock nut off of the bottom cable. Now its adjusted to just barely before popping.
This brought up another issue, though. The plates don't seem to be separating fully. The clutch basket feels loose, as if there's some in and out play, sliding on the shaft. Is this normal?
shouldn't be more than about 0.010"~0.020".
If you have more than that something isn't assembled right or shim is missing.
Not all clutches were shimmed at factory.
What shim do you speak of? it seems to be more than just a couple thousandths of an inch of play in my case. The problem is I have to turn the adjuster screw so far out that the ramp is no longer seated in its notch when it touches the pushrod, allowing it to just spin round and round. Its like the push rod is too short.
I've tried a new push rod, ramp, spring, advancer, and even side cover to no avail.. Tried a 5/16 ball bearing and it helped keep the ramp in place, but it still wasnt advancing far enough to separate the plates.
Its seems odd to me that the only thing holding the clutch assembly on the shaft is a simple snap ring. I feel that the only place a shim would belong is behind that snap ring to eat up some of the play.
Any advice on what size shim or where I could get one?
The hub is held on by a 1" circlip, some (I forget which) have a shim under the circlip to push hub further in.
Most just have the circlip, the bushing the basket runs on is also a spacer so you can't do much about that (shortening it isn't a good idea, can cause LOT of problems)
The basket movement doesn't really matter too much although it can be shimmed to give less clearance (and rattle)
Well the shim thing isn't working out. It still seems that the pushrod is too short. I have a cl350 engine sitting in the basement and I pulled the rod out of that and noticed that its the exact same length as the one out of my cl360. Are they the same part or should the 360 pushrod be a bit longer? Cant seem to find measurements online.
The whole front end of the bike came off a 350 so it wouldn't surprise me if this part was swapped out by the PO as well.
75 CL360: 22850-369-010
73 CL350: 22850-286-020
Different part numbers and the price is about double for the 360. Honda parts diagrams didn't give dimensions.
Sure do. Thanks for checking on that for me. Went to the salvage yard and pulled one straight out of a 360. Put it all together, and sure enough that extra 8mm made all the difference. Clutch plates are free and we're ready to ride!
Only thing is, the clutch lever seems a bit stiff. I don't think its the cable as its fresh and routed correctly. Think it'll loosen up when I get the thing running or should I go back to stock springs? Don't need a cable snapping on me while im breaking her in.
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