Senior Exit Project...

R

Rocan

"Long after I rest, my steel will live on"
I'm relying on you guys for this one... To graduate we are required to have research projects with a topic of our choice. My research question is how the publics outlook has changed on motorcyclists over the years.


Those of you who have ridden since the 60's and possibly earlier, I would like to know what your experience with the non-riding public was when they learned that you are a motorcyclist. Modern guys can hop in also, recalling how the publics outlook has changed in recent years (such as choppers being "cool" especially with the publicity given to it by tv shows such as OCC).


Lets keep it informative and proper; I'll be quoting some of the better posts.
 
Very cool Rocan. Not sure if I have anything to add to help you out, but If sure you can get an A with the help of beachcomber, PJ, and Hoof alone. Good luck.
 
Awesome! I'm currently rebuilding my GS450 as my senior exit project. Only got a few more months but I'm almost done.

That's all I wanted to say. My post was useless :( . Wait...

I can tell you that no one really thought of me as "cool" but now that I got a bike, things have sorta changed. Know what I mean ;) . Seriously.
 
dang no 60's riding here for this guy... but my old man rode his whole life... actually my uncles 60th b day is coming up next week, dad envited all the guys they used to ride with when they where younger... there will be over 100 bikes there. anything in particular i can ask them for you?
 
I started riding in '60. At that time there were very few Jap bikes around. Harleys or Brits. Out here on the west coast the Brits were mainly Triumph and BSA. There was a smattering of other Brits mainly in small shops that would specialise in a particular brand. I had a '56 DOT at one point and the only place for parts was a little shop in L.A. In Riverside Skip Fordyce was the Harley/Triumph dealer. Later to take on Honda sales. K&N (yes the same K&N that now do filters) sold BSA and Yamaha. Norton was imported by the Beliner Corp. in New York (?) and never made it out west in any large amounts.

In the early 60s in a small town like Riverside if you rode a bike you were either a Hell's Angel or a headcase. Generally they were not well liked. Murdercycles was a common term. I joined an old Riverside club called the Bombers. They were a racing club that also organised a couple of desert events each year. I mentioned it to a teacher in high school and rhe reply was "I wouldn't spread that around if I were you. I feel sorry for your parents."

As motorcycles were considered antisocial (blame Marlon Brando and "The Wild Ones") you could expected to be pulled over whenever you rode. Granted I spent too much of my youth in traffic court, usually for street racing or something similar, my view may be tainted. But you could expect to be pulled over and have your bike checked for compliance with all the laws. We had a couple of cops here in Riverside that specialised in that. So you just made sure you were legal. Unlike today you may have had rights but the cops didn't give a shit about them. And fighting them was a waste of time. Plus it just marked you for future hassling.

A fr'instance. The cop that gave me my first ticket was chasing a friend of mine, Tom. Tom rode an old leaky Matchless. Red tank and fenders. Out behind the airport Tom hing a right and headed out across the dirt. Terry (the cop) gave chase and crashed his Harley breaking both his legs. I went to the hospital to see him with the intention of laughing my ass off at him. But when I saw him with both legs in plaster I almost felt sorry for him. Riverside motorcyclists were a small bunch and we mostly knew everyone. The first thing Terry said to me was "Which one of your friends rides a red bike?" I sang dumb and he said "Bullshit!!". To make a long story short when I left the hospital I called Tom and told him to repaint his bike. A week later Tom cruised into my driveway with a new light blue paint job. If he hadn't when Terry got out of the hospital he'd have gone looking for him and probably beat shit out of him.

It was a whole different "scene" to today. But a whole lot more fun when you could run with a chance instead of having a helicopter over waiting for you to run out of gas.

P.S. It took Honda's "You Meet the Nicest People on a Honda" ad campaign to start to make people look at bikes in a different light.
 
I've only been riding since the mid '80's, so take it for whatever you think it's worth.
I remember seeing a biker shirt that said something like "You used to hate me, now you want to be me". I think that about sums up the current "Harley" culture. Or Hells Chiropractors, as I like to call the weekend wannabees. In the cruiser faction, it's become fashionable to ride a motorcycle now. To be able to point at it through the bar window and say "yea, it's mine".
In the sportbike faction, it's much the same. But it's not just ownership, "it's how fast can you go?" They only ride because it's thrilling, dangerous, exciting... If it wasn't bikes, it'd be skydiving or bunge jumping or lighting farts on fire.

Now of course, I'm not lumping everyone into those two catagories. There are those who truly love motorcycles and riding. Being out in the wind, becoming one with the machine... the Experience! And some will buy in for the fashion or the danger, and then "see the light" as it were. But they are few and far between.
That's how I see the majority of incoming riders.

As for the general public... I think they no longer see us as a threat. Something to be feared or shunned. I think the general public (if they even bother to look up from their smart phones while driving) sees us as an annoyance. Because what they "see" is the douchebag with open exhaust who's sitting at the redlight constantly blipping the throttle (cruiser faction), or zigzagging through traffic at triple digit speeds on one wheel (sportbike faction).
Both groups fall into the "Hey look at me!" faction.
No one notices the guy who's minding his own business, riding day in and day out, without jackassing all over the road... they're "The rest of us" faction.
As someone once stated "Not all Motorcyclists are Enthusiasts".
 
Thanks a lot guys!

Joe- Pretty much anything! Looking particularly for how the point of view of the motorcyclists compared to the point of view of the general public.

Hoof hit the nail on the head with the Honda campaign; thats what sparked me to use this question for my project. more recent guys; share your experience as well!

redbird: PERFECT stuff. thats what i need for my project. I will be getting points of view from people who do not ride as well. but it is VERY true that most people see a harley and think "show off" and see a sport bike and think "idiot." quite funny how the guy riding the dual sport with bright neon clothing and who attends msa meetings regularly floats into the background.

Ahh... and another fun part of it... I'm going to quote some of these posts. Swearing and all. It is fitting, I suppose.

keep it coming!
 
I started riding in the mid 50s.No Jap bikes only Brit and Euro bikes. We were then an oddity and were looked at as an amusement ,rather than a serious hobby.Early 60s it was still Brits and Euros, but seen as a more serious means of transport.The bike that changed it all IMO was the Honda 750 Super Sport. That marked the end of hobby and the beginning of the end for Brit bikes and the upscaling of Euro bikes.The Japanese owned the affordable performance bike market.bj
 
Also in the '70s came the realization that a bike could be an alternative for a second car in a family. I think the "gas crisis" of 72-78 had a lot to do with that. There was a cornucopia of 125cc-500cc bikes to chose from and almost all were sold with an ugly chrome rack on the back for running errands. And a 500cc was considered a big bike.
 
http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/future.htm
I read this awhile back. It was pretty interesting, and addresses the honda campaign.
But maybe you should consider picking a more mainstream topic. Depending on how strict the paper has to be, and how long it has to be. Our high school required a junior research paper. It had to be 8 pages fully backed up with a mixture of newspaper articles, encyclopedia articles, and other stuff. It had to be American history related. Most people chose the typical stuff, but I chose to do American Punk music (hardcore). Started out great, but in the end I didn't have enough legitimate sources to cite and had to bullshit some stuff (I cited a couple youtube videos, and it wasn't 8 pages). I didn't do great.
So this information is great for recreational knowledge, and I don't really doubt any of its validity, but its "the internet" and anybody can say anything. So most likely your teachers will be picky about where you get your information, and that topic doesn't sound like there will be enough "legitimate" information to back up. You can cite a few people as interviewing them, but if your project is like ours was, you need a LOT of sources. And this topic is very subjective as it is. Just my input. Based on my experience of choosing a somewhat unusual topic for a serious school paper, I would say choose something else. But I do think its a good idea, and good luck either way.
 
the project is quite similar to what you had to do. We were told it had to be specific and researchable, but not too specific. I should have plenty information to cite and will use figures such as the number of motorcycle sales or figures which show the statistic of riders and such as my legitimate sources.

the reason I chose to bring this question to the site is that I can get a vast idea of what people experienced. My school can attempt to deny the validity of my sources all they want; I will happily prove to them that these are first hand experiences and if anything will be more accurate then many sources currently present on the web.
 
Well I can't think of a better place. And good idea with the sales figures.
I just think you should make sure you can get enough sources (like databases, and encyclopedia type) before you get too far to change topics. I think you can do it, it just will be more difficult than more common topics since you'll have to search harder for "usable" information (stuff you can cite). I'm not saying they'll deny the firsthand experience, but for our project we needed a certain number of each source. If requirements are different, then just ignore me.
Anyway, I think it is a very interesting topic and wish you luck. I'm not trying to say don't do it, I'm just saying it might be harder to find lots of sources than you think.
I'll stop talking and let the wizened members chime in. At least you're getting a bump ;)
 
I'd like to comment on the previous posts. The Japs didn't arrive here until the late 50s and then in small amounts. The step though Honda 50 when it arrived sold like hotcakes. Parents didn't mind their kid on a Honda 50. 3 cubic inches. How much trouble can you get into with 3 cubic inches? "My lawn mower is bigger". Plus it looked nothing like a Harley. When Honda brought out the 305 and Yamaha their 250 twin they weren't seen as a threat. Compared to a 74 inch Harley they were small fry. But fast. You could nearly hit the ton with them. But the cops knew they were quick. Rocan, you can take that statement to the bank. My wallet took a beating more than once.

I went over to Ireland in '67. At that time over there a 500 was a full size bike. A 650 was a big bike and a 1000cc Vincent or Norvin was Godzilla! The CB750 quite simply changed motorcycling as it was known at that time. Four cyliders, OHC, hydraulic front disc. It was everything we could only dream of back then. Plus it would run to near 120 stock. And it nearly killed the British industry. The Brits were unable or unwilling to change that radically. The Japs convinced the world that performance was more important than gas mileage. The Brits clung to the mileage thing. Actually the death of the british industry is a book in itself.

I can remember seeing Honda ads showing a man in a business suit (and hat) riding to work on a Honda. I gess the idea was to show middle America that Hondas were socially acceptable. I must go dig out some of those ads. They were hilarious. Harley even got in on the act with their topper scooter and a guy in a suit on one.
 
glenn, thats definitely a lot of helpful stuff!

hoof... if you happen to have some of those ads, id be extremely appreciative if you could maybe scan them onto the web for me! I have a few saved here and there, but not many that relate directly to the japanese push for communal acceptance of motorcycles.
 
I just did a quick look. Heres a couple from here and a coule from England. To show the different attitude.

Montesa 1965. Clean cut (flattop but cool for the time), girlfriends, cute not trashy.

img002ioo.jpg


Kawasaki 1973. Nice cross section of middle America admiring the new Kawasakis. Notice the tiddlers are to the forefront and the Z1 discreetly in the background.

img001p.jpg


To contrast the attitude towards bikes between here and europe. Heres a couple from England.

National fuel ad from 1966.


img004xk.jpg



Yamaha ad from Motorcycle Sport 1976.


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Hey Rocan,


Why not use an app like polleverywhere.com? You could poll more seasoned riders and and newer riders via their cell phone texting. You set up the query and send the text code to those you target, they text their answer and viola...you've got direct data that you can download directly into a powerpoint, print as a table or pie-graph. Just one more tool to get a lot of data very quickly and easily. Not the sum of your research by any means but a easy way to add relevant and quantitative data to your research. And dude, the app is free!


Jim
 
thats pure gold hoof! Very helpful.


Jimmy; I'll have to check that out... sounds interesting...

in other news... I think I've made up my mind on college....

Rutgers here I come! Already shot a message to their Formula SAE team. Should be awesome having access to all that technology and tools; not to mention being surrounded by engineering students...
 
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