'71 cl350 --> '75 cb360 :: engine swap

D

dStew

New Member
I got a cl350 engine I'm trying to drop into my 360 frame...


I'm pretty sure this can be done but "how?" and "what do I need?" are my questions?
You folks haven't let me down before.
Thanks.
 
You need to fab new motor mounts and weld them on the frame. The 2 motors are not swappable without modifications. An exercise in futility and not worth the effort if you ask me.
 
350 will go into 360 frame (350 motor is physically smaller than 360)
360 won't fit into 350 frame without major surgery.
I think case is narrower as well so you may have to offset motor to get chain line right
 
crazypj:
so the 350 engine will drop in? with frame mods?


also, the 350 came with a set of scrambler pipes. if I stick with the 360 engine, can I use those scrambler pipes from a 350 on a 360?
thanks.
 
Don't know, never done it.
I only know because friend wanted 360 motor in 350 and it won't fit.
lifted 350 into 360 frame but never tried connecting anything up
I wouldn't bother because 360 is a 'better' motor for modification and can be made to last OK (plus it has 6 gears)
 
Its going to take frame modification is what theyre saying. The motors are different sizes and have the mounts in different places. As far as using 350 pipes on a 360 or vise versa... No can do, unless you do some cutting/welding/merging.
 
I guess it was because I read a lot about how the 360's have that cam tensioner issue and were Honda recalled for it in the early days. The ones that got recalled and fixed were stamped. Mine's not stamped. I've also heard parts for the 360s are hard to find compared to 350 stuff. I've also been told that its an easy swap but apparently not...kinda sounds like I been lied to, or nobody knows what they're talking about, haha!


Here's the whole situation:
A guy I know was getting rid of a 360 and he let me have it for free. It had 10k on it and, again, was free so I jumped on it. Before I started the project of tearing her down I did some reading and that's when I read about the issues with the 360's and how they were kind of a tossed together model [not reliable as or parts find-able]. SO I started looking for a donor engine in case mine turned out to be a crapper and I still dont know cuz I spent the winter tearing it apart and redoing the frame etc. Now that it's spring I'm getting into the engine, still unsure of its condition, when I happened upon a cl350 at a local swap. It had great rims, tank, scrambler pipes an extra set of 360 carbs, along with the stock 350 ones, and the potential donor engine I'd been looking for, so I scooped it up, got it home and am trying to figure what to do.


Now that I'm hearing that the engine and pipes from the 350 arent swap-able to the 360 though, I have no idea what to do.


Ideas? Suggestions?
 
Stick with the 360. It's a good bike and I've never had problems finding parts (except the cam chain slipper and tensioner).
 
So what do I do if those parts are crapped out? And how do I tell? I've got MINIMAL experience opening up an engine...
 
If parts are bad, you can replace them. Parts for the 350 and 360 are pretty easy to find.
To know whether or not they are bad, you should get a manual. You can find the pdf versions online or ask around. A lot of guys here will have them. The back pages of the manual state all the specifications for the engine and all you need to do is measure. If you're unsure about something, take some pics and post them here.

After just completing my first engine rebuild, I can personally attest to the fact that it's a lot easier than you think. Just be patient and don't be afraid to ask questions. Get a box of ziplok bags and label them for all the different parts and you're good to go.
 
I have a manual so I'll get to reading it then.
I guess what I meant was that its all so foreign to me that I didn't think I'd recognize an issue if it kicked me in the balls...manual or not! HAHA!


Thanks Sonrier!
Is there a good method for going through the engine? Common problem spots? Work top down? Did you have the tensioner/slipper issue?


thanksthanksthanks
 
Also, is the 360 a 74? I believe the first year 360s (1974) were the ones really prone to issues. At 10k, you should just need to do a basic once over (the manual will explain in detail) on the motor and be good. That is as long as its been well maintained. The stock 360 is not a performance motor. Treated right, and used as it was meant to be and you'll have no major problems with it.
 
It's a '75. As far as I know it was properly stored away in the guys shed in '89 and he stored it knowing he was putting it away for a while so I think it was done right? But I can't be sure...


I'm not looking to restore the bugger, I'm just setting it up to tear around town on ;D cafe brat style.
I should probably get pics up then, eh?
 
Pics help. One thing you should do if youre capable is to pull the head and have a machinist open/smooth all of the oil passages. Will help keep the 360 alive and shouldnt cost much at all. Also, the 360 in sgock form doesnt like to be run at full throttle for long periods of time. Keep it cool and off of the highway for any extended period and she'll treat ya right.
 
Yeah no plans for highway riding, I already have a ride for that so its just for cruising the town.
I'll have a chat with the local shop and have em give it a once over for me, then go from there.


Just so I know for sure, I asked about using the scrambler pipes from the cl350 on my 360 project. Is that possible or not?


I'd like to run pods on my 360 too. Any tips for that?


you guys are awesome.
 
No tensioner/slipper issue on mine. My CJ was a late model and you get get those issues on the first couple of years from the 360 ('74 and early '75, I think?).

Common trouble spots to check will be the cam, cam journals, and rocker arms. All of the surfaces of the cam, journals, and followers should look clean and polished. If you have black lines on the surfaces (as seen in this pick of my followers: Click for Pic) then it needs to be replaced.

Also, make sure the rocker arm shafts are all one piece. Some models had rocker arms that came apart and those were recalled.

A list of tools/parts you'll want or need:
  • Metric wrench/socket set (especially 10mm, 12mm, 14mm) and torque wrench
  • Impact driver (optional, but this is almost always a must)
  • Feeler gauges
  • Micrometer (digital is best for this)
  • Needle nose pliers
  • Circlip pliers (optional, but very handy)
  • New piston rings (buy these after you have the engine apart, so you know which size you need)
  • Honda clutch socket eBay Link
  • Engine gasket set
  • Engine bolt set (replaces old JIS screws which SUCK) eBay Link

For teardown of the engine, here's how I did it:

  • Left and right crank cases removed
  • Remove stator, neutral switch, and front sprocket from the left side of the case
  • Take off the points cover, followed by the points and advancer
  • Remove oil pickup, oil filter, idler gear, oil pump, and clutch from right side
  • Thoroughly clean oil pickup and oil filter (Leave the oil pump alone unless it's broken. So long as the gearing in the pump turns freely and you can hear it pushing a bit of air through, it's probably fine)
  • Remove breather cover from top of engine followed by by the rocker arm cover
  • Remove the rocker arms and valve caps from the rocker cover. If the heads come off of the rocker arm shafts then these are the old style and will need to be replaced.
  • Remove the slipper and tensioner being careful not to drop the tensioner bolts down into the engine
  • Remove the cam sprocket (again, don't lose the bolts)
  • Check side-to-side clearances in the cam play using a feeler gauge (this should be between .07 and .3 mm)
  • Remove the cam, stick a screw driver across the top of the head, inside the loop cam chain to keep it from falling down into the lower case
  • Inspect the cam for wear as detailed in the pic above
  • Remove the head
  • Remove the cylinder jugs (this often requires a good application of heat to the seam where the jugs meet the upper engine case, followed by a few good whacks with a rubber mallet)
  • Check cylinders for wear. They should be between 67.01 and 67.1 when measured front-to-back and side-to-side at the top, middle, and bottom. Top is usually a few cm from the top while bottom is location of the piston crown at BDC.
  • Check the outside diameter of the pistons at the skirt. This should be between 66.85mm and 66.97mm
  • Remove the pistons from the conn rods
  • Remove the large bolt/cap toward the back of the upper crank case. Remove the ball bearing from inside the exposed hole.
  • Flip the engine over onto its top, with the conn rods hanging off the edge of a table or something similar
  • Remove the bottom crank case
  • Remove the clutch lifter rod (if you haven't already)
  • Remove the main transmission
  • Remove the countershaft
  • Remove the shift arms and then the shifting drum
  • Remove the crankshaft
  • Check all specs according to the service manual. Some will have to be checked on reassembly, such are piston ring clearances, etc. Ensure all parts move smoothly and show no excessive signs of wear.

To assemble, just follow the instructions in reverse. You'll need some sealant (I use ThreeBond 1104) for the upper and lower crank cases as well as the mating surface between the head and rocker arm cover. All of the above assumes you're actually tearing the engine apart to fix a problem or you just want to do it for the experience. If something isn't broken, don't try to fix it.
 
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