Hoosier Daddy
Earache my eye...
o1marc said:
Pretty vague statement but I see them listed for many years in the 15mm already... no need to update list unless you are looking for specific year not shown.
Axle diameter size list
- Thread starter Hoosier Daddy
- Start date
Pretty vague statement but I see them listed for many years in the 15mm already... no need to update list unless you are looking for specific year not shown.
I'm looking at this list so I can see what bike use a 20mm axle AND have a mechanical speedo drive.
The NEXT question: Are most speedo drive ratios the same?
In other words, if I get a ZRX drive do I HAVE to use a Kawasaki speedometer?
Looking at a front end swap on a CB550 and wishing to keep the stock gauges. Can I mix and match drives and speedometers between brands?
The NEXT question: Are most speedo drive ratios the same?
In other words, if I get a ZRX drive do I HAVE to use a Kawasaki speedometer?
Looking at a front end swap on a CB550 and wishing to keep the stock gauges. Can I mix and match drives and speedometers between brands?
crazypj
Split personality, I fake being smart
Most speedo drives have different ratio's, even from the same manufacturer, plus, they may rate them differently.
Honda normally state on 'clock' how many 'turns' for one mile (2260 or so)
It also depends on wheel diameter and tyre size, if you change to something different you probably need different drive.
The best (although not cheapest) way to go would be GPS based with electronic second (although you have to calibrate properly)
Honda normally state on 'clock' how many 'turns' for one mile (2260 or so)
It also depends on wheel diameter and tyre size, if you change to something different you probably need different drive.
The best (although not cheapest) way to go would be GPS based with electronic second (although you have to calibrate properly)
SoyBoySigh
Been Around the Block
Well first of all, I'll address the SPEEDO issue ya'll were talking about:
Use ANY of 'em that you like! Take the GUTS out of 'em, usually just a circlip on each end holding 'em. Then replace the innards with a "HALL EFFECT SENSOR" aka magnetic speedo pick-up - AND you can run the wire down the length of an old speedo cable for the best possible rendering of the original bike's external appearance. And keep in mind, you don't necessarily have to keep the magnet INSIDE of the housing, you could conceivably run the wire to-&-through, and stick it onto the inner surface of the fork leg, maybe even up around the fender bracket etc - this way you're not limited to sticking the magnet in around the bearing spindle. You could use the conventional hollow-headed rotor bolt, with the sensor stuck to the caliper-hanger etc, with any exposed wires tucked away behind everything so as to keep up those "stealth" vibes. Or possibly even something like a magnet on a spoke or even the rim for that matter, made to look like a RIM-WEIGHT for wheel balancing. YEAH, I can really dig this idea - that way you could actually give the bike even MORE period-correct retro-vibes, all the while using those "Dyna-Beads" inside of your rims such that you wouldn't even NEED any stick-on wheel-weights etc.
Okay so yeah, the drive's been gutted. THEN you're gonna take the guts out of your CLOCK too, and then pick-&-choose a mix-&-match electric-analog dial drive from some later era model, any which really it shouldn't matter all that much. The guideline being, you're gonna look at the range of the dial sweep on the donor clocks and the SPEED of said bike, plus it's OEM wheel & tire, being careful to calculate it's "ROLLING diameter" using tire pressure and given weight etc. Then you'll need all of the same specs from your NEW application - which isn't gonna be standard anyhow - Am I right? For instance, I got this idea from HAVING to deal with a fixed-in-place speedo drive on the Suzuki 4LS drum in my teenage Daughter's "KZ440LOL" with it's 3.00x16" Borrani alloy front rim, for the low-profile Maxi-Scooter tires in 110/70-16 & 140/70-16....
And hey - the spoke people really whinged about fitment between the two, otherwise I'd certainly have pushed for an even bigger drum! In fact, I DID just that, IIRC - 'Cause yes I REALIZE the damn Suzuki 4LS is only a 200mm P.O.S. and double the weight of the T500 2LS with only a 25% increase in stopping power! Argh. Imagine my horror when I discovered that awesome Duck 900SS square-case bevel twin based homage to the Apollo V4, with IT'S 4LS drum squeezed into another 16" "Chopper" rear rim, albeit for some really shitting BALLOON tires - THEY'D managed to get away with a Grimeca 230mm, and their rim was a drop-center type as well! Seriously! Argh. But whatever - on practically ANY of the drum hubs, you're stuck with a speedo drive that's either gonna be half-assed functional, or it's gonna sit empty and you might as well put a cable sheath in there so it doesn't look stupid, right? Yeah, well - I played around with digging up replacement guts from later year GT's etc, but once I had the thing apart there was this "Aha Moment". And then a ha-ha moment. A bit of a laugh for all of the bikes I'd seen on the DOHC 'F-orum and the SOHC Four-ums and regular forums - The one which sticks out in my mind was the VF speedo grafted onto the engine sprocket of a CB750F/CB900F 'cause they'd chosen some VF wheel or other and felt stuck with the whole front end somehow. Of course, this is going back several years now, and the FRANKENBIKE people have certainly figured out that they've got other options! But I still feel it's "instructive" and it's lessons have application within the "Period-Correct Resto-Mod" and perhaps even the RESTORATION genres.....
So yeah, the really awesome thing to wrap it all up with, would be that we've all got PIE GRAPH programs on our PCs, we don't need to get out the Radian/Gradian Trigonometry here. That, AND there are folks doing reproduction printed vinyl clock dial sheets, all over the damn internet bike-o-sphere. I'm sure a custom lay-out MIGHT cost you a little bit more - heck, you might be able to print your own out on paper, use it to scribe some marks on a silicone "perf-board" type material, and then paint the damn thing yourself! Of course, only those guys with the re-prints can give you the truly beautiful period-correct marque & model specific FONTS etc.
My personal goal, would be to track down something which originally had a 16" front wheel, to match the new 16"-er on the KZ project - And I'm doing another 16" wheel on the "CB900K0 Bol Bomber", though only as an interim measure, which I've got AWESOME plans for down the road in any case - a 3.50x16" Super-Akront rim, to go with one of two 4.25x18" Akront rear wheels (conventional CB750F1 rear disc hub, and "Front Hub Trick" to shave weight - the bigger hub version will lend itself well to a SHAFT-DRIVE rear wheel down the road, for a GL1200-based pseudo-replica of the "Doncque DLF-1000" Gold-Wing based Endurance Racer from the '76 Bol D'Or, IOMTT, 24hrs d' Montjuich, Le Mans, etc etc - though the swing-arm & shaft limitations lead me to expect using any of the alternate rims on hand: 3.00x16" Borrani, 3.50x16" Super-Akront, 4.25x17"/5.00x17" 40-spoke modern Super-Moto, 2.50x18" Borrani, 3.00x18" Morad, 3.50x18" Super-Akront - Heck, with the Weld-Up HUB mods required of the GL1100/GL1200 wire-spoke conversion, you could actually use a 36-spoke rim, or a 48-spoke, 54-spoke - even the 60-spoke or 80-spoke stuff the Harley chopper people dig so much. But yeah, I'd want a 40-spoke wheel on the thing anyhow, for both crack prevention and weight reduction AND the period-correct OEM look for that matter. Anyway yeah, if the damn 'WING project isn't gonna work out with a 4.25x18" rim in the substituted GL1100 swing-arm, then it'll have to be used on a V65 Sabre/Magna based "CZ860K0 Sand-Cast" project. Which would probably be well worth doing a shaft-to-chain-to-belt conversion ala XS-eleven, Magni MV Agusta etc - Well one way or another, I'll figure out a more rational use for that damn drilling pattern, for such an enormous rear hub! And NO, I've seen these same later-era Akront extra-wide rims used on the DRUM hubs, and they look like shit imho. That's what the 3.50x18" Super-Akront is slated for, for a much more authentic PERIOD-CORRECT build. Well ... it's still gonna have the aforementioned SPEEDO mods of course!
*cough*
Yes - so like I was saying, the GOAL here is to find another model which already had the 16" front rim, and much the same size of tire up front (on the KZ440LOL it's 110/70-16 on the 3.00x16", on the CB900K0 Bol Bomber "version-one wheel", it's more like 130/60ZR16, depending on what's out there with a suitably matched profile for the corresponding 160/60ZR18 Sport-Touring radial - Perhaps some 120/70ZR16 or some such? Is there a 140/55ZR16 or anything like that?) Either which way, I'll be looking for speedo drives from bikes with a 16" Crotch-Rocket type front wheel, ala CBR900RR or CB600F Hornet, the "CB900F" aka 919, etc.
'Cause this way, I'll be looking at a bike with a very high top speed, and hence a clock with a range of around 300kph for the full sweep of it's dial. You see, that way when it's cut down to some 130kph based on past experience with the parent/donor model 1980 KZ440LTD - Well, maybe 140kph 150kph being generous for the mods I'm doing to it? So that means the needle's only gonna sweep half as far.
Ah, but this is a GOOD thing when I'm shooting for an OVAL bezel dual-clock, like CB160, CB450K0 Black Bomber, Yamaha YDS1 etc. I guess it's kinda tempting to do some kind of race-replica clocks for the Duck Bevel-Bubble fairing on the Bol Bomber, and yeah I could really see myself enjoying making a crappy replica of the old SCITSU electronic pick-up TACH' clocks, with a custom printed dial face, any random dial drive, and some cut-off from the 1/8" ABS black plastic sheet that I've got for playing around with air-box type of shit.... Yeah, a fake Scitsu could be a really simple project, but FUN at the same time! Heck, you could even sculpt the bezel surround in modelling clay, mould it in fiberglass, paint it - OR you could use some much thicker ABS sheet, and cut the fancy beveled edges with a high-speed router bit, compatible with plastic etc - Which would probably need a lot of polishing etc, so wtf it might do just as well to shape it by hand with a file or even a scraper blade etc - give it a bit of a fake buffing with some pipe-cement surface-prep cleaner? Hell, you might even get away with using SEWER PIPE fittings for the clock housings! Ha-ha. That way, no need to mess around with the hardware side of it, no tapping plastic for small tapered wood-screw style threads etc, just glue the whole damn thing together, pop the glass cover and spacer and the dial face with clock drive assembled all up in there, retain it all with a spring of some sort, put a threaded cap on the ass end of it? Might not even NEED to be water-tight on the underside, just pop in some of that black plastic foam that you'd cut the clock "surrounds" from? Like I say - this could be a very fun project!
I've heard tales of the old Brit-Bike resto guys, back in the day when the OEM parts were long out of production and not coming down the pipe any time soon - I've heard of people converting old alarm clocks on the one hand, yes - but CAT FOOD TINS on the other end of the spectrum. Ha-ha. Well so long as it's cleaned out properly? A slap of paint on it and who cares what it used to be? If it LOOKED right, and WORKED right, then it fit the bill. Damn though, the sheer SIZE of some of those old "Smiths Chronometer" housings, from the early Vincents? Wow. That's what I'd like to avoid!
So - WHATEVER - I just saw you guys talking about speedo drives and I thought to myself - "SOMEBODY'S gotta set these people straight!"
What I wanted to say about the AXLE DIAMETER charts, is that this is some very old information which was collected when these forums were in their infancy - in fact, I'm pretty sure it pre-dates DoTheTon altogether. Somebody who worked at a parts counter saw a bearings catalog and copied rows & columns of info straight onto their PC - and back then they didn't HAVE easy text scanning, they sat there and typed while looking at a book off to the side, like a trained secretary-typist straight out of the 1950s. Kudos to them! And THANK YOU, whomever you are. IF this person's even still ALIVE.
(((Hey - somebody should figure it out! Don't we all OWE something to this person? I should think we should at least pay for their next set of wheel and steering-head bearings, don't you think? Just a brain-fart!)))
What we need NOW, would be a table with stats cross-referenced, with a list of just about all the bike models we've even SEEN on these forums - or at least the models which we've seen here at least thirty or forty times before, for starters - the POPULAR shit.
We'd be much better served if the wheel bearing lists didn't just mention the AXLE diameter - 'cause it's no longer just about substituting an alternative drum hub
(((Though I've gotta say - SOOOOO many folks out there still miss the boat and FORGET to upgrade their drum hubs, when rebuilding or restoring an old special - I keep seeing people rebuild a CB160 or CB350 or more to the point the CL350, the CA72/CA77 etc, the models which had the same engines as their contemporaries but had smaller drum hubs with SLS plates instead of 2LS, etc - People go to the trouble of fully rebuilding and re-finishing their drum hubs, lacing up new spokes to new lightweight alloy racing rims. When for a couple of bucks more, literally only $10-$20ea when you consider they're fully media-blasting & re-powder-coating their old hubs with new bearings & shoes etc, re-chromed linkages & new electro-plating on the hardware & pivot cams etc - They might as well be grabbing the most clapped-out hubs you could FIND on eBay, when you wrap your head around it, and often as not there are superior hubs from their own marque's immediately "adjacent" models, or perhaps a step or two up the ladder of the "hand-me-down" scheme. And you see the same stuff with FORKS too - I find it especially exasperating when people throw a lot of $$$ at restoring an old 35mm Honda fork from the CB750F2 SOHC, let alone a 33mm for that matter - 'cause the 37mm & 39mm stuff from the DOHC series is functionally AND aesthetically identical - And you just know that there's a broken down Honda "parts bike" within a ten block radius of these people, too - with the EXACT parts they'd want to upgrade with, never mind the three block radius wherein they could find a really decent alternate donor part....)))
No, what these charts need to service NOW, would be the possibility of upgrading to equivalent or similar spec bearings of alternative dimensions, so as to fit their drum hubs or more to the point their wire-spoke front DISC-brake hubs ie CB750K SOHC / GL1000, KZ1000, GS750-GT750, Yam XS650 etc etc - Which for the most part originate with the 15mm axles
(OR in the case of the KZ1000 & it's ilk, the Kawasaki folk were so much more progressive in this ONE instance, in that they'd upgraded to the 17mm front axle many many years before their contemporaries made the leap!)
We need to have the reference HERE rather than each time having to search for it, so as to be able to adapt those older style hubs onto a fork with a 20mm axle. Heck even without the fork swap, these old bikes could all benefit from an UPGRADE KIT substituting a 20mm axle into the older forks, be they the early SOHC 35mm forks with the swinging calipers (Well if I'm being honest, IMHO these same $$$'s these same energies would be better spent modding later model fork lowers to take the swinging caliper hangers from these early SOHC bikes, such that you could stick a 39mm-41mm fork tube onto the front end of a Sand-Cast style build or CR750 replica - and maybe even bump those calipers up & out so as to match with a bigger rotor. The 9-rivet carriers, especially the later era version with the bigger center-carrier with the bigger circle of rivets, could be rebuilt with an outer disc ring of 310mm-316mm-320mm-330mm? Just a brain-fart.)
The 20mm axle upgrade though, now THAT was an actual period-correct race-bike mod, which a lot of the successful Endurance-Racing teams did to their Laverda SFC's & Jotas etc. Remembering of course that the Laverda 750 twin (or as I like to think of it, the Honda "CA770 MEGA-Dream") was cleaning up in the European endurance classes, and "Formula 750" etc, at least until the DOHC-4 came along. Just sayin' - could it be that their success was due to that beefy front AXLE? Well - even if there's no definitive proof, why leave it to chance? Yeah, the whole of the Honda SOHC-4/DOHC-4 and 4-banger Gold-Wing scene, not to mention the CBX Six - could ALL benefit from the 20mm front axle upgrade kit! Even if they were all just bumped up to the same 17mm axle as the KZ1000 & it's ilk, then that alone would be well worth the trouble.
'Cause I've heard it said that the more beefy axle might even be just as important to a stiff & stable front end as an add-on fork-brace. So yeah - THAT'S a decent reason why we'd all want to know about swapping the bearings in the HUBS, not just swapping hubs over from another model with the same diameter of axle.
By the same token, all of the FORK TUBE charts aren't just dealing with substituting alternative fork legs into your original yokes!
(((Though I suppose I've heard of some interesting uses for the fork seal and dust cap dimensions such as using 36mm seals on a 35mm fork, or 39mm on a 38mm tube etc - so as to lessen stiction on a race-bike. Interesting stuff. Makes me wonder whether you couldn't just take the seals out altogether and use a BOOT to keep the oil from going everywhere - Just a really free-breathing boot with some type of air filters stuffed into over-sized breather holes etc. Something with a whole lot of folds in the boots, kept static at a point mid-way through their elasticity, so as to minimize the additional "SPRING" action of the rubber boot itself. Maybe then, there'd be next to zero drag from the fork's sealing?)))
Well what the forks could use instead, would be a basic break-down of the YOKES, just in terms of the center-to-center width and the crown off-set, really. The STEM length numbers might be included with the steering stem bearing dimensions, 'cause they have more of a bearing on a total front-end swap (or more correctly put, a triple-tree swap - just 'cause you wanted the beefy fork itself or the wider yoke etc, you're not obligated to take the fugly crotch-rocket wheels or the cheesy floating rotors with the gold-anodized spider-flake/snow-web center carriers in 'em.
With ALL of the numbers at our disposal, we might be able to look at each of these parts as discrete components to be mixed & matched in a full-on tinker-toy construction. Maybe THEN we'll see an end to what I've dubbed the "STARBUCKS RACER" phenomenon, where you've got the air-cooled engine and backbone frame, maybe the gas-tank from the original classic machine which we all fell in love with - stuffed into the torso area of some fugly friggin' CROTCH-ROCKET! We'd be able to pick & choose, rather than taking the crunchy with the smooth....
So yeah, the AXLE info might as well tell you the LENGTHS as was mentioned up above - plus the SPACERS if you like, but then furthermore there ought to be some ancillary info as to the wheel bearings specifically to do with the bearing pockets, so folks can figure out for themselves whether they can stretch to this or that axle diameter - It might do well to give the rim dimensions, but only IF the thing's a one-piece wheel. I suppose there might be a separate collection of info on the wheels themselves, as per the "Victory Library" tables about the DRUM HUBS but which lacks much useful info about the OEM hubs from the JAPANESE models - I've been collecting pics & #'s of all the various Honda COMSTAR wheels, along with some scans I got for the Akront "NERVI" rims, and other similar rim profiles from Akront at the same time - I've got some cut-up rim sections (scrounged from my 2013 house-fire) which I've kept for profile end-on pics or scans, rather than constructing a diagram which might not give the right impression at all - ALL of this stuff is for my "Re-Invent The Wheel" project. Plus, I've been collecting info heck I've been collecting the rims THEMSELVES ha-ha, for the wire-spoke wheel swaps on my two current bike projects ... and the next TEN bike projects for that matter, some really sweet pairings which I might cook up one day, which I'd love to build 'em all for just the one model and swap 'em back & forth with each new set of tires! Of course, that's a good argument for building ten identical bikes, so that I wouldn't have to swap 'em back & forth! Ha-ha. Then again, you look at how that Fast & Furious actor died, from keeping a huge shed full of older sports-cars but not shoeing 'em with new TIRES every few years, with the end result of driving a sports-car with rock hard 10yr-old tires on the thing? Yeah, I really wouldn't wanna do THAT on a bike! No thanks. No, the whole point of collecting these rims wasn't about a static display. I'd like to try on all of the different possible configurations. Which is sheer lunacy, of course. Probably never gonna have the $$$ to finish it all, but I'll hang onto 'em until at least my next two or three projects. What's even crazier though, is that the wire-spoke wheel-swap aspects of the "Re-Invent The Wheel" project has only led to an obsession with the COMSTAR wheels - I'd like to build at least the ONE set of race-spec top-shelf Comstar wheels, in say 2.5x18/3.5x18 or 3.0x18/4.25x18 though it's tempting even to pull off what's possible right NOW with 2.5x18/3.0x16 Akront "NERVI" rims which are currently available - If only I'd jumped on that 2.5x18" & 3.0x18" pair of NOS "NERVI" rims which was for sale last year, instead of waffling over which of the two would make the better FRONT wheel, 'cause it ain't just about making 'em WIDER per se, it might make more sense t make a pair to match the original sizes only shave off 50% of their weight - THAT could be put to some decent use on some vintage racing circuit or other. But yeah, I don't have an interest in building anything in the stock sizes, so it wouldn't be much use to ME....
So what I was thinking is, we should put together a sticky thread where we could copy & paste stuff and ADD to it, or perhaps if people could contribute new information in a properly formatted way, then it could be copied & pasted to the original sticky at the top. I'm picturing a horizontal table where you could just add another line across the bottom, or of course it could be spliced in along the way. Conversely, a link to an Excel Spread-sheet type of deal. I dunno. However you SLICE it, anybody who's got a different model which hasn't been added yet, maybe they'll add what they learn as they go along. It would be a great way to consolidate everything, too - perhaps with a link to an image-heavy build-thread every now & again?
With time, perhaps a category for BRAKE info, where you could look at a fork & it's axle end with the caliper hanger mounting lugs in a simple three-point diagram or some such - then the caliper hangers and the calipers themselves. Perhaps with diagrams of the caliper PADS while you're at it - or at least those could be part & parcel of the page devoted to calculating the overall ratios, not just from the master-cylinder to the combined surface area of the piston faces, but ALSO incorporating the leverage ratios of the perch lever itself AND the caliper pad's working surface area.
And of course with THAT stuff in order there'd need to be an entire entry devoted to the brake rotors.There's a fantastic "Search By ..." function over at Metalgear Australia's site, where you can search by rotor diameter, or the number of bolt holes, the center hole diameter, the diameter of the bolt circle, etc etc - It's just too bad that they don't link BACK so that you could say, figure out which different FORK would work with a given pair of rotors. Now THAT would be some hella useful information. But instead, they just give you a link back to their part number and it's page with diagram etc. Useful stuff alright, but not quite as useful as it MIGHT'VE been, with an ability to back-track things & glean still more information.
I was diggin' through the thing, trying to find out what sort of fork Honda made with a DUAL-disc of 316mm's - turns out it was the same fork that I'd been contemplating using for another reason entirely, the 43mm TRAC fork from '96+ ST1100-ABS. Meanwhile I was looking into whether the GL1500 & PC800 were as similar as they might seem. Well, they're not - but it took some three or four fluke bits of information tied end-to-end before I figured out the PC800 could use the rear discs from USA-spec CB1100F as a 276mm to 296mm upgrade. Too bad I can't do the wire-spoke conversion, at least not the way I'd wanted to, on this here chopped-out GL1500 front "hub" as THIS one could've offered the "Faux-Leading-Shoe" fake drum brake a dual 316mm set-up via the rear discs for GL1500SE - Now THAT could've been one fantastic front end. But it's just as well, 'cause the 43mm TRAC fork with two left feet, which is to say two right-hand-side legs so as to have the anti-dive mechanism on BOTH legs - for an NS500/NSR500 replica vibe, well that thing could lend itself well to some re-built composite discs of the riveted type, whether that's from the SOHC or the DOHC or the Gold-Wing or the VF-series etc - It wouldn't be CHEAP per se, but IMHO the far more appropriate way to use such a fork would be with a pair of free-standing discs on this or that type of COMSTAR front wheel, whether that be a VF1000R 6-point Comstar or the Boomerang type - Then again, maybe a DYMAG wheel? There were some very particular calipers and especially the way the floating rotors were connected to their carriers, on those NS500's & NSR500's - It would wind up being a rather pricey thing to set up - Either which way, it wouldn't really SERVE you all that much, to keep the one side's caliper at the 316mm's spot, being that you'd might as well shoot for an entirely different style of caliper and try to get the thing RIGHT - Though at the same time, a budget version with just the one side's TRAC pivoting caliper-hanger to make from scratch, well that could make for a somewhat decent RACE-REPLICA vibe all of it's own. I mean, there'd be the BRAGGIN' RIGHTS, to be sure - but there's already a pretty decent 41mm TRAC fork with 296mm rotors and 20mm axle, in the form of the GL1500 front end. Or the same but with a 15mm axle, from the GL1200 - and if you wanted THAT fork to be a whole lot stiffer than usual you could stick in some ST1100-POLICE fork tubes, which were 41mm but built with a thicker wall and using a narrower diameter spring - Gotta wonder how much heavier it might be, but yeah it's FEASIBLE to throw together an extra-stiff version of the 41mm TRAC fork, and maybe just MAYBE the damn thing weighs less than the 43mm version anyhow. And the GL1500 fork is a RACE-REPLICA in it's OWN right, being more or less a boiled-down street-bike derivation of the TRAC fork from the '82 "CB750F" AMA Superbike, with all of the same specs etc. Ah, but still - the 43mm version just sounds soooo much sexier. It's the last time Honda threw together a TRAC anti-dive fork, SFAIK. And the biggest diameter TRAC fork they ever threw at a street-bike. Just too bad they did it lop-sided, that's all....
Well there you go- ANOTHER category, special case sort of thing just like the Honda COMSTAR wheels where somebody might wish to play mix-&-match with the rims & hubs - Well, the TRAC FORKS are a limited series all their own, with some actual cross-compatibility of their own. For instance, the CB1100R's 39mm TRAC fork with it's 296mm rotors, and the CB1100F/CB900F2 version of the 39mm TRAC fork with it's 276mm discs - I'd always assumed they were built entirely differently. Well, it turns out all you'd need to upgrade the CB1100F/CB900F2 fork to 296mm discs, are the caliper hangers themselves! Gotta wonder whether there isn't something could be done with OTHER such TRAC forks, where maybe the far more common GL1200 & GL1100 caliper hangers might swap over to the CB1100F/CB900F2 fork, for a much much cheaper version of that same 276mm-to-296mm rotor upgrade. Or even better still, perhaps some OTHER type of caliper hangers, might combine with yet some other fork of which I know not which - to upgrade for some truly awesome discs, on the order of 310mm-316mm-320mm-330mm. Not friggin' LIKELY, probably more like you'd have to use SMALLER rotors ha-ha.
And of course I should think we'd need some info on rear calipers and THEIR disc diameter, under-slung vs over top types, how many pistons etc - 'Cause I've got a bunch of ideas about alternative rear discs (AND HUBS!) for both wire-spoke wheels on Honda CB's & Gold-Wings etc - COMSTAR rear discs as well. Plenty of top secret backwards compatibility from all SORTS of different models. Heck it might even make sense just to list all the common bikes, model by model, and afix a quick list of all the most common mods & upgrades which least affect the bike's original aesthetics.....
A whole PILE of stuff which could be compiled in simple tables such as this.
Just a brain-fart!
-Sigh.
Use ANY of 'em that you like! Take the GUTS out of 'em, usually just a circlip on each end holding 'em. Then replace the innards with a "HALL EFFECT SENSOR" aka magnetic speedo pick-up - AND you can run the wire down the length of an old speedo cable for the best possible rendering of the original bike's external appearance. And keep in mind, you don't necessarily have to keep the magnet INSIDE of the housing, you could conceivably run the wire to-&-through, and stick it onto the inner surface of the fork leg, maybe even up around the fender bracket etc - this way you're not limited to sticking the magnet in around the bearing spindle. You could use the conventional hollow-headed rotor bolt, with the sensor stuck to the caliper-hanger etc, with any exposed wires tucked away behind everything so as to keep up those "stealth" vibes. Or possibly even something like a magnet on a spoke or even the rim for that matter, made to look like a RIM-WEIGHT for wheel balancing. YEAH, I can really dig this idea - that way you could actually give the bike even MORE period-correct retro-vibes, all the while using those "Dyna-Beads" inside of your rims such that you wouldn't even NEED any stick-on wheel-weights etc.
Okay so yeah, the drive's been gutted. THEN you're gonna take the guts out of your CLOCK too, and then pick-&-choose a mix-&-match electric-analog dial drive from some later era model, any which really it shouldn't matter all that much. The guideline being, you're gonna look at the range of the dial sweep on the donor clocks and the SPEED of said bike, plus it's OEM wheel & tire, being careful to calculate it's "ROLLING diameter" using tire pressure and given weight etc. Then you'll need all of the same specs from your NEW application - which isn't gonna be standard anyhow - Am I right? For instance, I got this idea from HAVING to deal with a fixed-in-place speedo drive on the Suzuki 4LS drum in my teenage Daughter's "KZ440LOL" with it's 3.00x16" Borrani alloy front rim, for the low-profile Maxi-Scooter tires in 110/70-16 & 140/70-16....
And hey - the spoke people really whinged about fitment between the two, otherwise I'd certainly have pushed for an even bigger drum! In fact, I DID just that, IIRC - 'Cause yes I REALIZE the damn Suzuki 4LS is only a 200mm P.O.S. and double the weight of the T500 2LS with only a 25% increase in stopping power! Argh. Imagine my horror when I discovered that awesome Duck 900SS square-case bevel twin based homage to the Apollo V4, with IT'S 4LS drum squeezed into another 16" "Chopper" rear rim, albeit for some really shitting BALLOON tires - THEY'D managed to get away with a Grimeca 230mm, and their rim was a drop-center type as well! Seriously! Argh. But whatever - on practically ANY of the drum hubs, you're stuck with a speedo drive that's either gonna be half-assed functional, or it's gonna sit empty and you might as well put a cable sheath in there so it doesn't look stupid, right? Yeah, well - I played around with digging up replacement guts from later year GT's etc, but once I had the thing apart there was this "Aha Moment". And then a ha-ha moment. A bit of a laugh for all of the bikes I'd seen on the DOHC 'F-orum and the SOHC Four-ums and regular forums - The one which sticks out in my mind was the VF speedo grafted onto the engine sprocket of a CB750F/CB900F 'cause they'd chosen some VF wheel or other and felt stuck with the whole front end somehow. Of course, this is going back several years now, and the FRANKENBIKE people have certainly figured out that they've got other options! But I still feel it's "instructive" and it's lessons have application within the "Period-Correct Resto-Mod" and perhaps even the RESTORATION genres.....
So yeah, the really awesome thing to wrap it all up with, would be that we've all got PIE GRAPH programs on our PCs, we don't need to get out the Radian/Gradian Trigonometry here. That, AND there are folks doing reproduction printed vinyl clock dial sheets, all over the damn internet bike-o-sphere. I'm sure a custom lay-out MIGHT cost you a little bit more - heck, you might be able to print your own out on paper, use it to scribe some marks on a silicone "perf-board" type material, and then paint the damn thing yourself! Of course, only those guys with the re-prints can give you the truly beautiful period-correct marque & model specific FONTS etc.
My personal goal, would be to track down something which originally had a 16" front wheel, to match the new 16"-er on the KZ project - And I'm doing another 16" wheel on the "CB900K0 Bol Bomber", though only as an interim measure, which I've got AWESOME plans for down the road in any case - a 3.50x16" Super-Akront rim, to go with one of two 4.25x18" Akront rear wheels (conventional CB750F1 rear disc hub, and "Front Hub Trick" to shave weight - the bigger hub version will lend itself well to a SHAFT-DRIVE rear wheel down the road, for a GL1200-based pseudo-replica of the "Doncque DLF-1000" Gold-Wing based Endurance Racer from the '76 Bol D'Or, IOMTT, 24hrs d' Montjuich, Le Mans, etc etc - though the swing-arm & shaft limitations lead me to expect using any of the alternate rims on hand: 3.00x16" Borrani, 3.50x16" Super-Akront, 4.25x17"/5.00x17" 40-spoke modern Super-Moto, 2.50x18" Borrani, 3.00x18" Morad, 3.50x18" Super-Akront - Heck, with the Weld-Up HUB mods required of the GL1100/GL1200 wire-spoke conversion, you could actually use a 36-spoke rim, or a 48-spoke, 54-spoke - even the 60-spoke or 80-spoke stuff the Harley chopper people dig so much. But yeah, I'd want a 40-spoke wheel on the thing anyhow, for both crack prevention and weight reduction AND the period-correct OEM look for that matter. Anyway yeah, if the damn 'WING project isn't gonna work out with a 4.25x18" rim in the substituted GL1100 swing-arm, then it'll have to be used on a V65 Sabre/Magna based "CZ860K0 Sand-Cast" project. Which would probably be well worth doing a shaft-to-chain-to-belt conversion ala XS-eleven, Magni MV Agusta etc - Well one way or another, I'll figure out a more rational use for that damn drilling pattern, for such an enormous rear hub! And NO, I've seen these same later-era Akront extra-wide rims used on the DRUM hubs, and they look like shit imho. That's what the 3.50x18" Super-Akront is slated for, for a much more authentic PERIOD-CORRECT build. Well ... it's still gonna have the aforementioned SPEEDO mods of course!
*cough*
Yes - so like I was saying, the GOAL here is to find another model which already had the 16" front rim, and much the same size of tire up front (on the KZ440LOL it's 110/70-16 on the 3.00x16", on the CB900K0 Bol Bomber "version-one wheel", it's more like 130/60ZR16, depending on what's out there with a suitably matched profile for the corresponding 160/60ZR18 Sport-Touring radial - Perhaps some 120/70ZR16 or some such? Is there a 140/55ZR16 or anything like that?) Either which way, I'll be looking for speedo drives from bikes with a 16" Crotch-Rocket type front wheel, ala CBR900RR or CB600F Hornet, the "CB900F" aka 919, etc.
'Cause this way, I'll be looking at a bike with a very high top speed, and hence a clock with a range of around 300kph for the full sweep of it's dial. You see, that way when it's cut down to some 130kph based on past experience with the parent/donor model 1980 KZ440LTD - Well, maybe 140kph 150kph being generous for the mods I'm doing to it? So that means the needle's only gonna sweep half as far.
Ah, but this is a GOOD thing when I'm shooting for an OVAL bezel dual-clock, like CB160, CB450K0 Black Bomber, Yamaha YDS1 etc. I guess it's kinda tempting to do some kind of race-replica clocks for the Duck Bevel-Bubble fairing on the Bol Bomber, and yeah I could really see myself enjoying making a crappy replica of the old SCITSU electronic pick-up TACH' clocks, with a custom printed dial face, any random dial drive, and some cut-off from the 1/8" ABS black plastic sheet that I've got for playing around with air-box type of shit.... Yeah, a fake Scitsu could be a really simple project, but FUN at the same time! Heck, you could even sculpt the bezel surround in modelling clay, mould it in fiberglass, paint it - OR you could use some much thicker ABS sheet, and cut the fancy beveled edges with a high-speed router bit, compatible with plastic etc - Which would probably need a lot of polishing etc, so wtf it might do just as well to shape it by hand with a file or even a scraper blade etc - give it a bit of a fake buffing with some pipe-cement surface-prep cleaner? Hell, you might even get away with using SEWER PIPE fittings for the clock housings! Ha-ha. That way, no need to mess around with the hardware side of it, no tapping plastic for small tapered wood-screw style threads etc, just glue the whole damn thing together, pop the glass cover and spacer and the dial face with clock drive assembled all up in there, retain it all with a spring of some sort, put a threaded cap on the ass end of it? Might not even NEED to be water-tight on the underside, just pop in some of that black plastic foam that you'd cut the clock "surrounds" from? Like I say - this could be a very fun project!
I've heard tales of the old Brit-Bike resto guys, back in the day when the OEM parts were long out of production and not coming down the pipe any time soon - I've heard of people converting old alarm clocks on the one hand, yes - but CAT FOOD TINS on the other end of the spectrum. Ha-ha. Well so long as it's cleaned out properly? A slap of paint on it and who cares what it used to be? If it LOOKED right, and WORKED right, then it fit the bill. Damn though, the sheer SIZE of some of those old "Smiths Chronometer" housings, from the early Vincents? Wow. That's what I'd like to avoid!
So - WHATEVER - I just saw you guys talking about speedo drives and I thought to myself - "SOMEBODY'S gotta set these people straight!"
What I wanted to say about the AXLE DIAMETER charts, is that this is some very old information which was collected when these forums were in their infancy - in fact, I'm pretty sure it pre-dates DoTheTon altogether. Somebody who worked at a parts counter saw a bearings catalog and copied rows & columns of info straight onto their PC - and back then they didn't HAVE easy text scanning, they sat there and typed while looking at a book off to the side, like a trained secretary-typist straight out of the 1950s. Kudos to them! And THANK YOU, whomever you are. IF this person's even still ALIVE.
(((Hey - somebody should figure it out! Don't we all OWE something to this person? I should think we should at least pay for their next set of wheel and steering-head bearings, don't you think? Just a brain-fart!)))
What we need NOW, would be a table with stats cross-referenced, with a list of just about all the bike models we've even SEEN on these forums - or at least the models which we've seen here at least thirty or forty times before, for starters - the POPULAR shit.
We'd be much better served if the wheel bearing lists didn't just mention the AXLE diameter - 'cause it's no longer just about substituting an alternative drum hub
(((Though I've gotta say - SOOOOO many folks out there still miss the boat and FORGET to upgrade their drum hubs, when rebuilding or restoring an old special - I keep seeing people rebuild a CB160 or CB350 or more to the point the CL350, the CA72/CA77 etc, the models which had the same engines as their contemporaries but had smaller drum hubs with SLS plates instead of 2LS, etc - People go to the trouble of fully rebuilding and re-finishing their drum hubs, lacing up new spokes to new lightweight alloy racing rims. When for a couple of bucks more, literally only $10-$20ea when you consider they're fully media-blasting & re-powder-coating their old hubs with new bearings & shoes etc, re-chromed linkages & new electro-plating on the hardware & pivot cams etc - They might as well be grabbing the most clapped-out hubs you could FIND on eBay, when you wrap your head around it, and often as not there are superior hubs from their own marque's immediately "adjacent" models, or perhaps a step or two up the ladder of the "hand-me-down" scheme. And you see the same stuff with FORKS too - I find it especially exasperating when people throw a lot of $$$ at restoring an old 35mm Honda fork from the CB750F2 SOHC, let alone a 33mm for that matter - 'cause the 37mm & 39mm stuff from the DOHC series is functionally AND aesthetically identical - And you just know that there's a broken down Honda "parts bike" within a ten block radius of these people, too - with the EXACT parts they'd want to upgrade with, never mind the three block radius wherein they could find a really decent alternate donor part....)))
No, what these charts need to service NOW, would be the possibility of upgrading to equivalent or similar spec bearings of alternative dimensions, so as to fit their drum hubs or more to the point their wire-spoke front DISC-brake hubs ie CB750K SOHC / GL1000, KZ1000, GS750-GT750, Yam XS650 etc etc - Which for the most part originate with the 15mm axles
(OR in the case of the KZ1000 & it's ilk, the Kawasaki folk were so much more progressive in this ONE instance, in that they'd upgraded to the 17mm front axle many many years before their contemporaries made the leap!)
We need to have the reference HERE rather than each time having to search for it, so as to be able to adapt those older style hubs onto a fork with a 20mm axle. Heck even without the fork swap, these old bikes could all benefit from an UPGRADE KIT substituting a 20mm axle into the older forks, be they the early SOHC 35mm forks with the swinging calipers (Well if I'm being honest, IMHO these same $$$'s these same energies would be better spent modding later model fork lowers to take the swinging caliper hangers from these early SOHC bikes, such that you could stick a 39mm-41mm fork tube onto the front end of a Sand-Cast style build or CR750 replica - and maybe even bump those calipers up & out so as to match with a bigger rotor. The 9-rivet carriers, especially the later era version with the bigger center-carrier with the bigger circle of rivets, could be rebuilt with an outer disc ring of 310mm-316mm-320mm-330mm? Just a brain-fart.)
The 20mm axle upgrade though, now THAT was an actual period-correct race-bike mod, which a lot of the successful Endurance-Racing teams did to their Laverda SFC's & Jotas etc. Remembering of course that the Laverda 750 twin (or as I like to think of it, the Honda "CA770 MEGA-Dream") was cleaning up in the European endurance classes, and "Formula 750" etc, at least until the DOHC-4 came along. Just sayin' - could it be that their success was due to that beefy front AXLE? Well - even if there's no definitive proof, why leave it to chance? Yeah, the whole of the Honda SOHC-4/DOHC-4 and 4-banger Gold-Wing scene, not to mention the CBX Six - could ALL benefit from the 20mm front axle upgrade kit! Even if they were all just bumped up to the same 17mm axle as the KZ1000 & it's ilk, then that alone would be well worth the trouble.
'Cause I've heard it said that the more beefy axle might even be just as important to a stiff & stable front end as an add-on fork-brace. So yeah - THAT'S a decent reason why we'd all want to know about swapping the bearings in the HUBS, not just swapping hubs over from another model with the same diameter of axle.
By the same token, all of the FORK TUBE charts aren't just dealing with substituting alternative fork legs into your original yokes!
(((Though I suppose I've heard of some interesting uses for the fork seal and dust cap dimensions such as using 36mm seals on a 35mm fork, or 39mm on a 38mm tube etc - so as to lessen stiction on a race-bike. Interesting stuff. Makes me wonder whether you couldn't just take the seals out altogether and use a BOOT to keep the oil from going everywhere - Just a really free-breathing boot with some type of air filters stuffed into over-sized breather holes etc. Something with a whole lot of folds in the boots, kept static at a point mid-way through their elasticity, so as to minimize the additional "SPRING" action of the rubber boot itself. Maybe then, there'd be next to zero drag from the fork's sealing?)))
Well what the forks could use instead, would be a basic break-down of the YOKES, just in terms of the center-to-center width and the crown off-set, really. The STEM length numbers might be included with the steering stem bearing dimensions, 'cause they have more of a bearing on a total front-end swap (or more correctly put, a triple-tree swap - just 'cause you wanted the beefy fork itself or the wider yoke etc, you're not obligated to take the fugly crotch-rocket wheels or the cheesy floating rotors with the gold-anodized spider-flake/snow-web center carriers in 'em.
With ALL of the numbers at our disposal, we might be able to look at each of these parts as discrete components to be mixed & matched in a full-on tinker-toy construction. Maybe THEN we'll see an end to what I've dubbed the "STARBUCKS RACER" phenomenon, where you've got the air-cooled engine and backbone frame, maybe the gas-tank from the original classic machine which we all fell in love with - stuffed into the torso area of some fugly friggin' CROTCH-ROCKET! We'd be able to pick & choose, rather than taking the crunchy with the smooth....
So yeah, the AXLE info might as well tell you the LENGTHS as was mentioned up above - plus the SPACERS if you like, but then furthermore there ought to be some ancillary info as to the wheel bearings specifically to do with the bearing pockets, so folks can figure out for themselves whether they can stretch to this or that axle diameter - It might do well to give the rim dimensions, but only IF the thing's a one-piece wheel. I suppose there might be a separate collection of info on the wheels themselves, as per the "Victory Library" tables about the DRUM HUBS but which lacks much useful info about the OEM hubs from the JAPANESE models - I've been collecting pics & #'s of all the various Honda COMSTAR wheels, along with some scans I got for the Akront "NERVI" rims, and other similar rim profiles from Akront at the same time - I've got some cut-up rim sections (scrounged from my 2013 house-fire) which I've kept for profile end-on pics or scans, rather than constructing a diagram which might not give the right impression at all - ALL of this stuff is for my "Re-Invent The Wheel" project. Plus, I've been collecting info heck I've been collecting the rims THEMSELVES ha-ha, for the wire-spoke wheel swaps on my two current bike projects ... and the next TEN bike projects for that matter, some really sweet pairings which I might cook up one day, which I'd love to build 'em all for just the one model and swap 'em back & forth with each new set of tires! Of course, that's a good argument for building ten identical bikes, so that I wouldn't have to swap 'em back & forth! Ha-ha. Then again, you look at how that Fast & Furious actor died, from keeping a huge shed full of older sports-cars but not shoeing 'em with new TIRES every few years, with the end result of driving a sports-car with rock hard 10yr-old tires on the thing? Yeah, I really wouldn't wanna do THAT on a bike! No thanks. No, the whole point of collecting these rims wasn't about a static display. I'd like to try on all of the different possible configurations. Which is sheer lunacy, of course. Probably never gonna have the $$$ to finish it all, but I'll hang onto 'em until at least my next two or three projects. What's even crazier though, is that the wire-spoke wheel-swap aspects of the "Re-Invent The Wheel" project has only led to an obsession with the COMSTAR wheels - I'd like to build at least the ONE set of race-spec top-shelf Comstar wheels, in say 2.5x18/3.5x18 or 3.0x18/4.25x18 though it's tempting even to pull off what's possible right NOW with 2.5x18/3.0x16 Akront "NERVI" rims which are currently available - If only I'd jumped on that 2.5x18" & 3.0x18" pair of NOS "NERVI" rims which was for sale last year, instead of waffling over which of the two would make the better FRONT wheel, 'cause it ain't just about making 'em WIDER per se, it might make more sense t make a pair to match the original sizes only shave off 50% of their weight - THAT could be put to some decent use on some vintage racing circuit or other. But yeah, I don't have an interest in building anything in the stock sizes, so it wouldn't be much use to ME....
So what I was thinking is, we should put together a sticky thread where we could copy & paste stuff and ADD to it, or perhaps if people could contribute new information in a properly formatted way, then it could be copied & pasted to the original sticky at the top. I'm picturing a horizontal table where you could just add another line across the bottom, or of course it could be spliced in along the way. Conversely, a link to an Excel Spread-sheet type of deal. I dunno. However you SLICE it, anybody who's got a different model which hasn't been added yet, maybe they'll add what they learn as they go along. It would be a great way to consolidate everything, too - perhaps with a link to an image-heavy build-thread every now & again?
With time, perhaps a category for BRAKE info, where you could look at a fork & it's axle end with the caliper hanger mounting lugs in a simple three-point diagram or some such - then the caliper hangers and the calipers themselves. Perhaps with diagrams of the caliper PADS while you're at it - or at least those could be part & parcel of the page devoted to calculating the overall ratios, not just from the master-cylinder to the combined surface area of the piston faces, but ALSO incorporating the leverage ratios of the perch lever itself AND the caliper pad's working surface area.
And of course with THAT stuff in order there'd need to be an entire entry devoted to the brake rotors.There's a fantastic "Search By ..." function over at Metalgear Australia's site, where you can search by rotor diameter, or the number of bolt holes, the center hole diameter, the diameter of the bolt circle, etc etc - It's just too bad that they don't link BACK so that you could say, figure out which different FORK would work with a given pair of rotors. Now THAT would be some hella useful information. But instead, they just give you a link back to their part number and it's page with diagram etc. Useful stuff alright, but not quite as useful as it MIGHT'VE been, with an ability to back-track things & glean still more information.
I was diggin' through the thing, trying to find out what sort of fork Honda made with a DUAL-disc of 316mm's - turns out it was the same fork that I'd been contemplating using for another reason entirely, the 43mm TRAC fork from '96+ ST1100-ABS. Meanwhile I was looking into whether the GL1500 & PC800 were as similar as they might seem. Well, they're not - but it took some three or four fluke bits of information tied end-to-end before I figured out the PC800 could use the rear discs from USA-spec CB1100F as a 276mm to 296mm upgrade. Too bad I can't do the wire-spoke conversion, at least not the way I'd wanted to, on this here chopped-out GL1500 front "hub" as THIS one could've offered the "Faux-Leading-Shoe" fake drum brake a dual 316mm set-up via the rear discs for GL1500SE - Now THAT could've been one fantastic front end. But it's just as well, 'cause the 43mm TRAC fork with two left feet, which is to say two right-hand-side legs so as to have the anti-dive mechanism on BOTH legs - for an NS500/NSR500 replica vibe, well that thing could lend itself well to some re-built composite discs of the riveted type, whether that's from the SOHC or the DOHC or the Gold-Wing or the VF-series etc - It wouldn't be CHEAP per se, but IMHO the far more appropriate way to use such a fork would be with a pair of free-standing discs on this or that type of COMSTAR front wheel, whether that be a VF1000R 6-point Comstar or the Boomerang type - Then again, maybe a DYMAG wheel? There were some very particular calipers and especially the way the floating rotors were connected to their carriers, on those NS500's & NSR500's - It would wind up being a rather pricey thing to set up - Either which way, it wouldn't really SERVE you all that much, to keep the one side's caliper at the 316mm's spot, being that you'd might as well shoot for an entirely different style of caliper and try to get the thing RIGHT - Though at the same time, a budget version with just the one side's TRAC pivoting caliper-hanger to make from scratch, well that could make for a somewhat decent RACE-REPLICA vibe all of it's own. I mean, there'd be the BRAGGIN' RIGHTS, to be sure - but there's already a pretty decent 41mm TRAC fork with 296mm rotors and 20mm axle, in the form of the GL1500 front end. Or the same but with a 15mm axle, from the GL1200 - and if you wanted THAT fork to be a whole lot stiffer than usual you could stick in some ST1100-POLICE fork tubes, which were 41mm but built with a thicker wall and using a narrower diameter spring - Gotta wonder how much heavier it might be, but yeah it's FEASIBLE to throw together an extra-stiff version of the 41mm TRAC fork, and maybe just MAYBE the damn thing weighs less than the 43mm version anyhow. And the GL1500 fork is a RACE-REPLICA in it's OWN right, being more or less a boiled-down street-bike derivation of the TRAC fork from the '82 "CB750F" AMA Superbike, with all of the same specs etc. Ah, but still - the 43mm version just sounds soooo much sexier. It's the last time Honda threw together a TRAC anti-dive fork, SFAIK. And the biggest diameter TRAC fork they ever threw at a street-bike. Just too bad they did it lop-sided, that's all....
Well there you go- ANOTHER category, special case sort of thing just like the Honda COMSTAR wheels where somebody might wish to play mix-&-match with the rims & hubs - Well, the TRAC FORKS are a limited series all their own, with some actual cross-compatibility of their own. For instance, the CB1100R's 39mm TRAC fork with it's 296mm rotors, and the CB1100F/CB900F2 version of the 39mm TRAC fork with it's 276mm discs - I'd always assumed they were built entirely differently. Well, it turns out all you'd need to upgrade the CB1100F/CB900F2 fork to 296mm discs, are the caliper hangers themselves! Gotta wonder whether there isn't something could be done with OTHER such TRAC forks, where maybe the far more common GL1200 & GL1100 caliper hangers might swap over to the CB1100F/CB900F2 fork, for a much much cheaper version of that same 276mm-to-296mm rotor upgrade. Or even better still, perhaps some OTHER type of caliper hangers, might combine with yet some other fork of which I know not which - to upgrade for some truly awesome discs, on the order of 310mm-316mm-320mm-330mm. Not friggin' LIKELY, probably more like you'd have to use SMALLER rotors ha-ha.
And of course I should think we'd need some info on rear calipers and THEIR disc diameter, under-slung vs over top types, how many pistons etc - 'Cause I've got a bunch of ideas about alternative rear discs (AND HUBS!) for both wire-spoke wheels on Honda CB's & Gold-Wings etc - COMSTAR rear discs as well. Plenty of top secret backwards compatibility from all SORTS of different models. Heck it might even make sense just to list all the common bikes, model by model, and afix a quick list of all the most common mods & upgrades which least affect the bike's original aesthetics.....
A whole PILE of stuff which could be compiled in simple tables such as this.
Just a brain-fart!
-Sigh.
SoyBoySigh
Been Around the Block
Well, I'll tell you what I'm thinking about with respect to CHAIN oil, at least. I've long wanted to do the SCOTT-OILER thing, but as I'm sure you've all guessed by now, I'm too much of a granola-head to be comfortable with dumping out a half Liter of petroleum oil with every weekend's riding - I guess I can handle BURNING the shit, which is probably an even bigger deal when you wrap your head around the climate disaster - But yeah in this instance I'm thinking about water-sheds. Of course there's already an ass load of oil slopped all over the roads, from leaking gaskets and people spilling it on their engines when they top it up, no doubt a goodly amount of all that just drips out the end of all those tail-pipes on all those damn cages. But I just don't want to ADD to it, not if I can avoid it!
So - I'm thinkin' maybe I'll figure out some type of COOKING oil to use in the Scott-Oiler. Something tasty and with low levels of poly-unsaturates, none of the BAD cholesterols, etc. Maybe something which SMELLS good? Then again, I'd hate to cause more lil' critters to get ROAD-KILLED. Bad Karma. I'm guessing the Theater Popcorn "butter" is a no-go. That shit would probably rot the chain. I mean 'cause it's always hydrogenated, full of emulsified water, SALT, & shit like that.
So whaddya all think would SPOIL one's final-drive? (Don't need it on the KZ440LOL, that one's got an all-NOS belt-drive, so it's only gonna be SPF-100 sun-block, more so than a LUBE per se. Maybe some of those water-based, rectal-safe personal lubricants?) Speaking of WHICH, *cough* Do you think AVOCADO oil would be alright? Walnut? Grape-Seed is supposed to be the most flavour-less of the healthy cooking oils.
I'd guess that regular CANOLA oil would be the least likely to tempt the lil' critters out of the canola fields, being that they've already got their fill of seeds to eat. After all the RAPE-SEED, which Canola was developed from, is supposed to be an incredible, old's-cool industrial lubricant, which even today there's still a big market for the stuff. I guess it's a bit thicker though, and I'm looking for something light enough to fling itself off of the sprockets so as to remove all of the dust & dirt. Probably best to look very closely at the viscosity. Which again, has me thinking about the Grape-Seed stuff.
The RAPE-SEED oil though - with that one, there's always the "Alberta Wheat-Pool" style hat, with the fine print about "National Association of Rape-Seed Farmers all-natural and without genetic modification, an affiliate of Industrial Lubricant entrepreneurs blah-blah-blah...." of which the words "RAPE" and "FARMERS" are the only prominent lettering, with the next size down font just the words "Without ... Lubricant" barely legible, then all the other words seeming like a textile weave or decorative motif.... - Yeah, I think I'd want the sponsorship stickers on my fairing, too.
If I had my druthers, and no doubt a whole lot more $$$ would be another prerequisite, I'd do yet another BELT-DRIVE conversion, but on the HONDA this time - I've long had my eye on the "Poly-Chain GT Carbon" system from Gates Industries. That would be waaay cool.
Ah, but you know - much as I'd love to have the belt for the extra horses it delivers, but I think this Scott-Oiler thing will finally put to rest my misgivings about the chain-drive - and this organic GM-free free-range LUBE solution puts an end to my kvetching about the Scott-Oiler solution.
If only there were something similar for the ENGINE oil. Hmmm.... There was a Fabulous Furry Freak Brothers comic about that, where they took their VW bus to a total Granola-Head mechanic, who was fast & courteous & affordable, and the bus ran like a dream - even the exhaust smelled better. Until it threw a rod, and some kind of pleasant-smelling goop ran out of the hole in the crank-case. Freewheelin' Franklin stuck his finger in the goop & gave it a taste - "Avocados, re-fried beans, and bananas?" Bah, I've gotta dig up that strip and scan it here. It's not online yet. Perhaps they were ON to something though. I mean, if anybody were privy to secret 1970's granola-head research meant to bring down the "rich-pigs" and their evil oil industry, it would've been Gilbert Shelton & Paul Mavrides. Then again, the whole comic is chockablock full of loathing for hippies & pot-heads, which is why I loved it so much as a kid, having grown up in the shadow of the dirty white, shark's underbelly of the hippie biker generation - let's just say they were very recognizable characters to the young would-be Mr. Tofu. Just sayin', I think a TRUE hippie publication would've turned that into some self-righteous propaganda piece about the conspiracy against HEMP as a replacement fuel, lube, food, hair-product, ass-wipe, birth-control, analgesic, stimulant & suppressant, panacea for all that ails ya.
*cough* Well in a WORD, I just use whatever's on the shelf! If it's the right specification, I'll throw it into the bike. Right now I've got the Honda house-brand oil in 'er, got a bunch more one Liter bottles enough for one full change, and change.
Well maybe it won't be "and change", 'cause the plan THIS time 'round is to use a whole lot MORE of it - with my own patented DIY sandwich-style DEEP-SUMP mod, upsized cooler & extra-long lines, maybe a remote tank and run the deep-sump DRY-sump style. Kinda defeats the purpose, ha-ha. But yeah as it stands the deep-sump mod will add an extra Liter, and the upsize cooler & extended big-bore lines, maybe another 750mL, more or less. Thing is, I might have to do things differently than I had on the old 750, 'cause the 985 has this really tight WOLF PIPE on it. Got me thinking about a remote FILTER housing as well, to avoid having to take the damn thing off the bike all the damn time. BUT, the sandwich trick would work on just about any other wet-sump bike too, so it's worth looking at even if it doesn't help ME right now. The NEXT bike project, another DOHC-Honda, 750 though I don't care if it's a 'K or an 'F or a 'C, I've already got all sorts of awesome upgrade parts for it, 39mm fork, 2.5x18 & 3.5x18 wire-spoke alloy rims, 296mm dual-disc front brakes with the CB1100R type vented double-thick discs which just gotta swap out a different center-carrier to work on the 6-bolt hub, fairing-bracket for a full bubble or a dust-bin, rear-sets & MC's & swing-arm & - this that & the other. If I don't use this here 750 frame for the 985, then all the 750 needs is a replacement/rebuilt engine. Anyway what it DOESN'T have is a decent exhaust that's worth using - Well, thinking ahead to this DEEP-SUMP mod, I'm gonna throw that 4-into-4 header from Cycle-Exchange onto it - so I can dangle a great big ball-sack of a deep-sump down between those pipes. I'd like to try something like a GL1000/CX500 style central collector muffler all tucked up tight where the center-stand normally goes. But with little stubs of 4 straight pipes poking out the ass end of it, so it looks like a straight "Shotgun" style pipe, from the sides anyhow - Not when you lean over and flash the crowd an up-skirt look-see, but it wouldn't look weird if there's a deep-sump in front of it. Sounds like a lot of weight, but it wouldn't have to be BUILT like the OEM version, it could have really thin walls, heck maybe it could be made from alloy? I was thinking about the long straight sections, too. Maybe they could be replaced with straight stock off-the-shelf Titanium pipe. Gotta be expensive, but nowhere near as pricey as a full welded header made from the stuff. Was thinkin', IF it makes up for the added weight from the extra clamps involved, then maybe it'd be worth-while.
Well either way, whether you get to see it here first or not, ya'll should look into the sandwich-style deep-sump mod. 'Cause it SHOULD work for practically any other wet-sump engine. Provided you've got a couple of spare sump-pans kicking around - all the better if they're all dinged-up or even better still if they're cracked or had a rod thrown through 'em.
-Sigh.
So - I'm thinkin' maybe I'll figure out some type of COOKING oil to use in the Scott-Oiler. Something tasty and with low levels of poly-unsaturates, none of the BAD cholesterols, etc. Maybe something which SMELLS good? Then again, I'd hate to cause more lil' critters to get ROAD-KILLED. Bad Karma. I'm guessing the Theater Popcorn "butter" is a no-go. That shit would probably rot the chain. I mean 'cause it's always hydrogenated, full of emulsified water, SALT, & shit like that.
So whaddya all think would SPOIL one's final-drive? (Don't need it on the KZ440LOL, that one's got an all-NOS belt-drive, so it's only gonna be SPF-100 sun-block, more so than a LUBE per se. Maybe some of those water-based, rectal-safe personal lubricants?) Speaking of WHICH, *cough* Do you think AVOCADO oil would be alright? Walnut? Grape-Seed is supposed to be the most flavour-less of the healthy cooking oils.
I'd guess that regular CANOLA oil would be the least likely to tempt the lil' critters out of the canola fields, being that they've already got their fill of seeds to eat. After all the RAPE-SEED, which Canola was developed from, is supposed to be an incredible, old's-cool industrial lubricant, which even today there's still a big market for the stuff. I guess it's a bit thicker though, and I'm looking for something light enough to fling itself off of the sprockets so as to remove all of the dust & dirt. Probably best to look very closely at the viscosity. Which again, has me thinking about the Grape-Seed stuff.
The RAPE-SEED oil though - with that one, there's always the "Alberta Wheat-Pool" style hat, with the fine print about "National Association of Rape-Seed Farmers all-natural and without genetic modification, an affiliate of Industrial Lubricant entrepreneurs blah-blah-blah...." of which the words "RAPE" and "FARMERS" are the only prominent lettering, with the next size down font just the words "Without ... Lubricant" barely legible, then all the other words seeming like a textile weave or decorative motif.... - Yeah, I think I'd want the sponsorship stickers on my fairing, too.
If I had my druthers, and no doubt a whole lot more $$$ would be another prerequisite, I'd do yet another BELT-DRIVE conversion, but on the HONDA this time - I've long had my eye on the "Poly-Chain GT Carbon" system from Gates Industries. That would be waaay cool.
Ah, but you know - much as I'd love to have the belt for the extra horses it delivers, but I think this Scott-Oiler thing will finally put to rest my misgivings about the chain-drive - and this organic GM-free free-range LUBE solution puts an end to my kvetching about the Scott-Oiler solution.
If only there were something similar for the ENGINE oil. Hmmm.... There was a Fabulous Furry Freak Brothers comic about that, where they took their VW bus to a total Granola-Head mechanic, who was fast & courteous & affordable, and the bus ran like a dream - even the exhaust smelled better. Until it threw a rod, and some kind of pleasant-smelling goop ran out of the hole in the crank-case. Freewheelin' Franklin stuck his finger in the goop & gave it a taste - "Avocados, re-fried beans, and bananas?" Bah, I've gotta dig up that strip and scan it here. It's not online yet. Perhaps they were ON to something though. I mean, if anybody were privy to secret 1970's granola-head research meant to bring down the "rich-pigs" and their evil oil industry, it would've been Gilbert Shelton & Paul Mavrides. Then again, the whole comic is chockablock full of loathing for hippies & pot-heads, which is why I loved it so much as a kid, having grown up in the shadow of the dirty white, shark's underbelly of the hippie biker generation - let's just say they were very recognizable characters to the young would-be Mr. Tofu. Just sayin', I think a TRUE hippie publication would've turned that into some self-righteous propaganda piece about the conspiracy against HEMP as a replacement fuel, lube, food, hair-product, ass-wipe, birth-control, analgesic, stimulant & suppressant, panacea for all that ails ya.
*cough* Well in a WORD, I just use whatever's on the shelf! If it's the right specification, I'll throw it into the bike. Right now I've got the Honda house-brand oil in 'er, got a bunch more one Liter bottles enough for one full change, and change.
Well maybe it won't be "and change", 'cause the plan THIS time 'round is to use a whole lot MORE of it - with my own patented DIY sandwich-style DEEP-SUMP mod, upsized cooler & extra-long lines, maybe a remote tank and run the deep-sump DRY-sump style. Kinda defeats the purpose, ha-ha. But yeah as it stands the deep-sump mod will add an extra Liter, and the upsize cooler & extended big-bore lines, maybe another 750mL, more or less. Thing is, I might have to do things differently than I had on the old 750, 'cause the 985 has this really tight WOLF PIPE on it. Got me thinking about a remote FILTER housing as well, to avoid having to take the damn thing off the bike all the damn time. BUT, the sandwich trick would work on just about any other wet-sump bike too, so it's worth looking at even if it doesn't help ME right now. The NEXT bike project, another DOHC-Honda, 750 though I don't care if it's a 'K or an 'F or a 'C, I've already got all sorts of awesome upgrade parts for it, 39mm fork, 2.5x18 & 3.5x18 wire-spoke alloy rims, 296mm dual-disc front brakes with the CB1100R type vented double-thick discs which just gotta swap out a different center-carrier to work on the 6-bolt hub, fairing-bracket for a full bubble or a dust-bin, rear-sets & MC's & swing-arm & - this that & the other. If I don't use this here 750 frame for the 985, then all the 750 needs is a replacement/rebuilt engine. Anyway what it DOESN'T have is a decent exhaust that's worth using - Well, thinking ahead to this DEEP-SUMP mod, I'm gonna throw that 4-into-4 header from Cycle-Exchange onto it - so I can dangle a great big ball-sack of a deep-sump down between those pipes. I'd like to try something like a GL1000/CX500 style central collector muffler all tucked up tight where the center-stand normally goes. But with little stubs of 4 straight pipes poking out the ass end of it, so it looks like a straight "Shotgun" style pipe, from the sides anyhow - Not when you lean over and flash the crowd an up-skirt look-see, but it wouldn't look weird if there's a deep-sump in front of it. Sounds like a lot of weight, but it wouldn't have to be BUILT like the OEM version, it could have really thin walls, heck maybe it could be made from alloy? I was thinking about the long straight sections, too. Maybe they could be replaced with straight stock off-the-shelf Titanium pipe. Gotta be expensive, but nowhere near as pricey as a full welded header made from the stuff. Was thinkin', IF it makes up for the added weight from the extra clamps involved, then maybe it'd be worth-while.
Well either way, whether you get to see it here first or not, ya'll should look into the sandwich-style deep-sump mod. 'Cause it SHOULD work for practically any other wet-sump engine. Provided you've got a couple of spare sump-pans kicking around - all the better if they're all dinged-up or even better still if they're cracked or had a rod thrown through 'em.
-Sigh.
