Primer over gelcoat?

High On Octane said:
I've been painting for 10 years so imagine all the VOCs I've been exposed to. If you're painting in your garage put a box fan in a window or doorway to keep the air circulating.

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Ya this sounds cheesy and ghetto but I was thinking I would use a tent I don't care about this time, open the window flaps and put in a box fan in one of the windows to pull the air out of the tent. I have the full suit and full mask.

For the paint it says I have to wait 6 to 8 hours before taping to layer another color. What max time do you think I would have to paint again without having the need to sand? 24 hours?
 
That should work just fine. Might need some lights on there too so you can see what your doing and don't have any shadows.

Scottie J
 
Thanks for the help!

The sealer talk got me researching sealer. I am interested but man its another step! Making a long 2 days to paint a 2 tone motorcycle paint job and I have 3 bikes to paint so extra steps add up.

I have good painting hardware but I am a novice gun painter and still learning. But I love the PPS system, so easy to setup and clean! It was kind of costly but I am after efficiency over cost.

Since I have 2 different media's (metal and gel coat), metal is blasted and seat is sanded at 500. I was thinking of these three options. I'm not an expert painter so I am after what is best for my current skills, ease, lower room for error and an above average quality as even with the best products at my skill level (and tent lol) I wont achieve show room.

Option 1:

TANK
1-2 coats of etch primer on exposed metal.
2-3 coats high build primer on whole tank.
sand 600
3-4 coats of single stage color 1
2-4 coats of color 2

SEAT
2 coats high build primer.
sand 600
3-4 coats of single stage color 1
2-4 coats of color 2

or

Option 2:

TANK
1-2 coats of etch primer on exposed metal.
2-3 coats urethane primer sealer combo.
sand 600 or not sand?? (I read sealers don't need sanding?)
3-4 coats of single stage color 1
2-4 coats of color 2

SEAT
2-3 coats urethane primer sealer combo.
sand 600 or not sand?? (I read sealers don't need sanding?)
3-4 coats of single stage color 1
2-4 coats of color 2

or

Option 3:

TANK
1-2 coats of etch primer on exposed metal.
2-3 coats high build primer on whole tank.
sand 600
Sealer
3-4 coats of single stage color 1
2-4 coats of color 2

SEAT
2 coats high build primer.
sand 600
sealer
3-4 coats of single stage color 1
2-4 coats of color 2
 
You don't need etching primer when you are using a 2K primer, it is self etching. Just get a gallon of Shop Line JP202 (PPG's entry "jobber" paint line) a qt of catalyst and a gallon of medium reducer. If the tank has imperfections do 3 coats of primer mixed 4:1:1 and then sand to 500 grit. After that, mix the primer 4:1:2 do 2 coats like I talked about and spray 2-3 coats of your 1st color and let it cure 48 hours. Mask off your 2 tone area and scuff with a scotch brite pad, then remove that masking and remask the area and spray 2-3 coats of your secondary color.

Scottie J
 
High On Octane said:
You don't need etching primer when you are using a 2K primer, it is self etching. Just get a gallon of Shop Line JP202 (PPG's entry "jobber" paint line) a qt of catalyst and a gallon of medium reducer. If the tank has imperfections do 3 coats of primer mixed 4:1:1 and then sand to 500 grit. After that, mix the primer 4:1:2 do 2 coats like I talked about and spray 2-3 coats of your 1st color and let it cure 48 hours. Mask off your 2 tone area and scuff with a scotch brite pad, then remove that masking and remask the area and spray 2-3 coats of your secondary color.

Scottie J

Ok. So I understand; what's the purpose of the re masking?
 
Once you have scuffed or sanded around the tape the tape loses it's integrity. The purpose of retaping it is so that you have a clean sharp edge on your 2 tone when you pull the tape.

Scottie J
 
High On Octane said:
Once you have scuffed or sanded around the tape the tape loses it's integrity. The purpose of retaping it is so that you have a clean sharp edge on your 2 tone when you pull the tape.

Scottie J

Ya i figured as much.

I have a paint tip. Drink a beer after painting in areas with fumes. Helps remove the minor headache.
 
mathil said:
I won't get in to recommending certain products, that's something I trust to the local paint supply guys. Best aim though is to get the same product on both pieces before the basecoat goes on.

You know. I'm going to have to disagree with you on this. While some paint reps and sales persons have been selling paint for a while and know their stuff, there are just as many new employees that THINK they know everything and can give you bad advice. Also, just because they sell paint, doesn't mean they have ever in their life ever held a paint gun in their hand. The best advice comes from actual painters who know what they are doing. Example: A paint salesman can tell you "with this product you need to spray 2 dust coats followed by 2 medium wet coats" but chances are he doesn't even know what the hell a dust coat looks like let alone know how to spray it properly. A good painter with the right attitude will tell you what you need to do and HOW to do it. But on the flip side, A LOT of good painters won't tell you shit and keep everything to themselves because they afraid of someone taking their job. I, on the other hand, enjoy helping others and as long as someone is willing to listen and learn, I don't mind giving out my secrets. Another example is I went to a new paint supplier one time that sold different products than I was used to using. I told him what I had been spraying and what I was looking for. He sold me a a quart of Xtreme Clear and said to spray it like any other clear. But the clear is much thinner than other clears and when I sprayed it I had runs all over hell. Needless to say I threw away the rest of that clear and never went back to that shop again.

HollywoodMX said:
Ya i figured as much.

I have a paint tip. Drink a beer after painting in areas with fumes. Helps remove the minor headache.

So does a bowl of some fine Colorado Medicinal. ;)
 
I have good reps I guess. I buy Sherwin Williams stuff, and they have their own store. There's a lady behind the counter that has no idea what she's doing, but that's ok, she just runs the debit machine. My rep actually paints, gets great training from the company, and knows the company line BS from reality. He can give me specific advice on a wide range of products, and not just a jobber shops favorites. If I need to know what air cap to use with what tip at what pressure, he's got an informed answer for me.

Most people who have to ask the questions on a forum probably don't even know that high end guns come with different air caps, or how they effect the process. I don't really want to take total responsibility for someone's decisions, just give them general sound advice that helps them figure out their own path. I could say, "use U-pol high build primer, sand to 400, apply 2 coats of ATX sealer, allowing 30 minutes flash before applying 3 coats of ATX basecoat. Follow with 3 coats of Finish-1 clearcoat and buff within 48 hrs", but they'll usually come back with, "I can't get ATX base, can I use watercolours diluted with horse urine and get the same effect?"

I operate on the assumption that someone can tell if their salesman sucks, or whether they have good knowledge. The same could be said of the internet, but it's an even worse situation. E-how should be "E-how-not-to", and although a lot of people are proud of their hobbyist pursuits, most of the time they fall short of what I would be comfortable calling "professional" and charging money for. Hobbyist forums give hobbyist advice, and filtering out the gold from the copper is the best skill an aspiring learner could aquire.
 
mathil said:
.......I operate on the assumption that someone can tell if their salesman sucks, or whether they have good knowledge. The same could be said of the internet, but it's an even worse situation. E-how should be "E-how-not-to", and although a lot of people are proud of their hobbyist pursuits, most of the time they fall short of what I would be comfortable calling "professional" and charging money for. Hobbyist forums give hobbyist advice, and filtering out the gold from the copper is the best skill an aspiring learner could aquire.

+1

I shoot only PPG products these days. I tried using Shrinking Williams ;D but didn't get very good results so I switched back to PPG. But just for the record, this is a fiberglass seat cowl that was also in gel coat. I used the exact same products and technique that I described earlier.



Scottie J
 
High On Octane said:
+1

I shoot only PPG products these days. I tried using Shrinking Williams ;D but didn't get very good results so I switched back to PPG. But just for the record, this is a fiberglass seat cowl that was also in gel coat. I used the exact same products and technique that I described earlier.



Scottie J

Looks good! Ya i can't get ppg. Napa made a policy that they can't sell to home users anymore. :'(

Since I'm not a pro anyways I'm using limco supreme. (basf).
 
HollywoodMX said:
Looks good! Ya i can't get ppg. Napa made a policy that they can't sell to home users anymore. :'(

Since I'm not a pro anyways I'm using limco supreme. (basf).

Yeah, I saw that. I've never used Limco so I can't give you any info or tips on it. Sorry.
 
High On Octane said:
Yeah, I saw that. I've never used Limco so I can't give you any info or tips on it. Sorry.

No worries. I have used their 2 stage. It turned out well after I learned the 3 second stick drip trick. It went on pretty flat (white). I used that Brazilian clear coat on it (car something?) . That was harder for me to learn.
 
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