1970 Honda CL450 "Ginger"

Re: 1970 Honda CL450 (project kickass)

Based upon our conversation in the chat box on the main page, I think you have two different issues. The shifter being loose isn't really a good sign, but because the bike rolls freely in neutral and the kickstarter will turn the transmission with the clutch in, I don't think the loose shifter is related to the engine not turning.

"Seizing" is probably not a good word to use for this issue. I would probably lean toward "catching" or "binding" or something similar. If I understand correctly, the crank will turn about 1.5 turns in either direction but at that point it refuses to turn further?
 
Re: 1970 Honda CL450 (project kickass)

that is correct matt...turns freely to a point. then it "catches" and won't go further. As to the shifter, what do you think would cause this? is there a spring on the shift lever inside the clutch cover that i may have missed? like i said, i didn't touch the lower case and it worked just fine before...
 
Re: 1970 Honda CL450 (project kickass)

im thinking its a valve,
Click to expand...
Being on the other side of a keyboard instead of there in person, I suspect you are right....
Don't force it and recheck your valve timing.
 
Re: 1970 Honda CL450 (project kickass)

milehigh said:
that is correct matt...turns freely to a point. then it "catches" and won't go further. As to the shifter, what do you think would cause this? is there a spring on the shift lever inside the clutch cover that i may have missed? like i said, i didn't touch the lower case and it worked just fine before...
Click to expand...

#19 in this pic: http://images.cmsnl.com/img/partslists/gearshift-drumkick-startergearshift-spindle-cb450-super-sport-450-k2-usa_bighu0100e2014_1bb6.gif

That's the return spring for the gear shift lever. I think you can access it with the right crank case cover removed and the clutch taken out.
 
Re: 1970 Honda CL450 (project kickass)

tip top guys, thanks for the input. Those are clearly important things to remember.

I think the other issue is simply timing. Not entirely sure yet, but after pulling the inspection covers, the valves are all still good, in place and moving. Ran out of time last night, so tonight hopefully progress will be made.

Thanks again.

H
 
Re: 1970 Honda CL450 (project kickass)

Matt or Hoosier, you guys have a link to a site where i can order said clip and washer?
 
Re: 1970 Honda CL450 (project kickass)

milehigh said:
Matt or Hoosier, you guys have a link to a site where i can order said clip and washer?
Click to expand...

I did not find it on hondapartsnation or on hondadirectline (hdlparts).com

I found the washer is PN 24621-200-000 and the circlip is 90603-200-000. Those numbers should help you with your search. Most parts vendores have a "Quick look-up" where you can simply paste the number in a search box and see if it is available.
 
Re: 1970 Honda CL450 (project kickass)

Check the camsprocket and chain alignment.

I almost guarantee you that you are a few teeth off on the chain, which will make the valves open at the wrong time and contact the top of the piston.
 
Re: 1970 Honda CL450 (project kickass)

SONICJK said:
Check the camsprocket and chain alignment.

I almost guarantee you that you are a few teeth off on the chain, which will make the valves open at the wrong time and contact the top of the piston.
Click to expand...

...and the winner is!!! so yeah...the cam timing was off...The markings on the cams (the exhaust cam specifically) don't seem to coincide with proper timing when i have the crank on LT. I've tweaked it a bit, found out the rear was on the casting mark not the notch marking it was supposed to be on...so i fixed that, put it all together again...and the same problem but on a different valve--opening into the piston. Luckily i gave it about a light kick the first time i tried or that would have totally miffed it up. I've pulled the side covers 4x and the followers so i can have enough play in the cams to adjust the chain, and this turned out to be a way easier way to adjust than breaking the chain again. and that brings us to my current issue.

I've got complete rotation from the crank now...its not catching on the valve, it cycles as its supposed to (or rather just allows a crank rotation without restriction) but as i sit and kick ever so lightly, the right side seems to have far more compression (air shooting from the plug hole) than the left side does--when in riding position. Can the motor still cycle as though its working without it being properly timed? I can see that as the left piston rises, the intake valve is still closing (just closing before the piston reaches the top)...so that would probably explain the lack of compression on that side...but i am a bit of a noob, so i don't really know.

Thanks for the help and advice,

H
 
Re: 1970 Honda CL450 (project kickass)

ok, so i was off on the timing mark on the exhaust cam. i fixed that. things seem normal. i put everything back together and the right cyl is firing spot on...nothing on the left. (when in riding position). I've confirmed that there is spark on the left plug, haven't messed much with the ignition timing or syncing the carbs...what are the thoughts?
 
Re: 1970 Honda CL450 (project kickass)

took some pics...shitty ones, but at least they show progress! I still can't get the right cyl to fire...i've confirmed spark, but haven't pulled off the stator cover (as that causes oil to leak) to do the timing yet...but i think i've got the cam timing all lined up, so thats an accomplishment. Also, haven't messed with the carbs, so that could also be an issue causing my non firing right side.


Cheers,

H
 

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Re: 1970 Honda CL450 (project kickass)

milehigh said:
ok, so i was off on the timing mark on the exhaust cam. i fixed that. things seem normal. i put everything back together and the right cyl is firing spot on...nothing on the left. (when in riding position). I've confirmed that there is spark on the left plug, haven't messed much with the ignition timing or syncing the carbs...what are the thoughts?
Click to expand...

Timing first, then carbs. Poor timing can mask any number of ills. Also, check compression if you haven't done that. You want around 150 PSI. If/when you get it running and warmed up, check compression again. The "real" number you want is 165 PSI but that's tricky until things are warm.
 
Re: 1970 Honda CL450 (project kickass)

Wow that's awesome! That all just works so well together... great stuff!
 
Re: 1970 Honda CL450 (project kickass)

sick build. like the tank, the light and the wrap

can you say after using the spraymax 2k on the tank how much of a gloss increase it gave it vs when it was bare? scale from 1-10

thanks
 
Re: 1970 Honda CL450 (project kickass)

milehigh said:
got my engine mounts all painted up....not sure what i think of the gold. might look kinda funky with what i've already got going on. thoughts are welcome! Should i add more gold components or stick to the simple black and silver?
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Hi milehigh
Can you tell me what brand and color you used on these? And did you use the same on those engine parts? Thanks!
 
Re: 1970 Honda CL450 (project kickass)

VHT metallic engine enamel for the plates and engine parts. Gloss on tank was increased significantly when spraymax 2k was applied. i did use the "high gloss"

Thanks!

H
 
Re: 1970 Honda CL450 (project kickass)

Very nice job on the bike. I just picked up a 1973 Cl today love the look of these motors.
 
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