'74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna - "Done"!

Re: '74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna (renamed) and First Ride!

Well I bench synced with a paper clip and closed down the idle screw so it wouldn't start up too high. From that point she actually ran pretty well. Once I started adjusting the screw she started running like junk again.
 
Re: '74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna (renamed) and First Ride!


Sonreir said:
Checked for air leaks yet?

No air leaks around carb boots. All good there. Seems the mini spring was not the answer, as the right cylinder was not firing after all. Back to the bench to re fit original spring.

Getting sick of screwing around with the ol girl right now. Been 3 70+ degree days in a row and I'm here messing around instead of riding.
 
Re: '74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna (renamed) and First Ride!

Welcome to the fun of owning a 360. ;D
 
Re: '74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna (renamed) and First Ride!


frogman said:
Welcome to the fun of owning a 360. ;D

It was more fun when she was in pieces

Got the carbs back in and actually got them synced. Not sure what was keeping them out of sync but I got em within 1 cm/Hg of each other. I'll take it.

Now more weird shit is happening. You can notice an oddity in the exhaust note, it happens sporadically and not rhythmically. Still seems like a misfire. I've noticed it only occurs when there's no load on the engine, mostly at idle or decel. While accelerating I don't notice anything.

https://vimeo.com/142311404

So much for a ride
 
Re: '74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna (renamed) and First Ride!

Ethanol in the gas. Switch to 100-octane leaded and it will smooth right out.


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Re: '74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna (renamed) and First Ride!


redwillissuperman said:
Ethanol in the gas. Switch to 100-octane leaded and it will smooth right out.

Highest octane they sell around here is 93. Guess that's better than not.
 
Re: '74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna (renamed) and First Ride!

Where are you located? 93-octane can actually be a problem. Sunoco in Canada has 93-octane but it's highly oxygenated. Michigan has 93-octane and it's great. But Michigan also has a few Speedway gas stations that sell 100-octane unleaded at the "short hose" pumps.


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Re: '74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna (renamed) and First Ride!

Go to http://racegas.com/fuelfinder


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Re: '74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna (renamed) and First Ride!

I'm in MA. Looks like there's a few stations within 15 miles that sell it.
 
Re: '74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna (renamed) and First Ride!

Something must be wrong with my CB360. Runs great on 10% ethanol and 87 Octane. So does my 750. Weird man...
 
Re: '74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna (renamed) and First Ride!


Mydlyfkryzis said:
Something must be wrong with my CB360. Runs great on 10% ethanol and 87 Octane. So does my 750. Weird man...
Just a lower standard of what is "great"

gasoline has 114k BTU per gallon. Straight ethanol has 76k BTU per gallon, a 90/10 mixture would have approximataly 110k BTU per gallon (114k * 0.9 + 76k * 0.1). The E10 gasoline gallon equivalent 1.036 (114k/110k = 1.036). Basically, your engine will produce 3.4 percent less power per power stroke on E10 than it would on straight gasoline because there is 3.4 percent less energy in the same quantity of fuel.

From a combustion dynamics point of view, E10 is not a homogeneous mixture. The ethanol clumps together and has a lower flame point. Thus, the ethanol burns first creating one flame front, and then the gasoline flame front begins to propagate. This is exacerbated in a small displacement engine fed by a carburetor, such as a lawn mower or a motorcycle.

Another issue is the fact that ethanol is an oxygenate, bringing oxygen with it in the fuel (-OH), when it burns it creates a lean condition vs the same settings for pure gasoline. This effects idle quality since the flame kernel initiation is at a much leaner rate than stoichiometric, such as 16.5:1 vs 14.7:1. This is true even if the gross event is 14.7:1 for the reason explained above.

So, can your CB360 be made to run "great", probably. But the described "pish-push" sound at idle is typically poor combustion dynamics. My experience is that switch from E10 to a better fuel can clean up the idle, improve power, increase fuel economy and reduce the cost of food for all.







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Re: '74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna (renamed) and First Ride!

Ok because I didnt understand 99% of all that.

I use 90 octane pure gas in my 360, cm200, cl100

1. Is 100 octane pure gas harder to ignite than 90 octane pure gas?

2. Would it be best to run a hotter plug? Burning 100 octane in a lower compression engine.

Off the top of my head I dont recall what the 360s compression is 9-1, 9.5-1.
 
Re: '74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna (renamed) and First Ride!


trek97 said:
Ok because I didnt understand 99% of all that.

I use 90 octane pure gas in my 360, cm200, cl100

1. Is 100 octane pure gas harder to ignite than 90 octane pure gas?

2. Would it be best to run a hotter plug? Burning 100 octane in a lower compression engine.

Off the top of my head I dont recall what the 360s compression is 9-1, 9.5-1.

Can we start a new topic somewhere? I don't want to hijack the thread. I was just trying to solve the idle issue since I am doing the exact same thing with a CB360 right now. I used 91-octane E10 instead of my usual 100-octane leaded.


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'74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna (renamed) and First Ride!

I'll be honest, I'm having my doubts that this is a fuel related issue. I've run plenty of carbureted motorcycles off 87 octane and never had a noticeable issue with idle. I have noticed a difference in performance with higher octane fuel but never a significant negative effect on the idle.

The engine was warming up yesterday and it made an odd click-stutter noise. The only way I can describe is is when you put the AC on in your car and you can feel/hear the engine bog when the compressor kicks in.

I've a feeling now that the carbs are pretty much in order, that it has to do with valves and cam chain. I'm going to grab some 3mm threaded rod to screw into the cam chain tensioner, retract it all the way and reset it with the valves slack, as I never got the normal 'snap' when I initially adjusted it.
 
Re: '74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna (renamed) and First Ride!

Now it's been heat cycled a few times, re-do valve adjustment then re-sync carbs.
If it doesn't sync or runs better way out of sync, something is wrong.
BTW, you have re-jetted for the foam filters?
 
Re: '74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna (renamed) and First Ride!

I thought the oddity was in the exhaust note not valvetrain noise. Can't help you there.


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Re: '74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna (renamed) and First Ride!

Yep, slight 'spit' at idle, need to pull plugs and see if it's a lean or rich miss (although it's probably carbs way out of sync?)
 
Re: '74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna (renamed) and First Ride!

crazypj said:
Yep, slight 'spit' at idle, need to pull plugs and see if it's a lean or rich miss (although it's probably carbs way out of sync?)

Carbs are synced. Plugs are showing rich mix, I am at stock jetting at the moment on foam filters and 2-into-1.

Waiting on rod to pull back (to disengaged position) cam chain tensioner, will then reset valves and reset cam chain.

redwillissuperman said:
I thought the oddity was in the exhaust note not valvetrain noise. Can't help you there.

That was my original concern, until I noticed the 'skip' at idle, after the fact.
 
Re: '74 CB 360 Cafe Build - Luna (renamed) and First Ride!

With stock compression, use 87 octane.
At idle, 93 octane will probably still be burning when exhaust valve opens.
My 378cc motors with higher compression run fine on 87~90 octane (whatever it gets, it gets ;D )
 
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